February 09, 2005
Revote Rally / Election Reform Meeting in Vancouver

The first public meeting of Secretary of State Sam Reed's "Election Reform Task Force" will be held this Thursday evening, Feb. 10 in Vancouver.

These public meetings are opportunities for citizens around the state to give their input for the election reform commission appointed by former Attorney General Gregoire and led by Secretary Reed. I'm more than a little skeptical that this commission will produce much in the way of needed reforms, but it is an opportunity to impress upon Secretary Reed, the legislature and the temporary governor that citizens demand more sweeping election reforms than Reed and the Democrats have proposed heretofore.

The Vancouver meeting will take place from 6:30 - 8:30 pm Thursday, Feb 10, at Clark College Foster Auditorium, 1800 E McLoughlin Blvd., Vancouver. Directions here. Show up 30 minutes early so you can register and make a statement at the meeting.

This is also an opportunity to make a big statement for a revote. Josephine Wentzel with the Clark County Republicans e-mails:

Wear something orange. We encourage you to bring constructive homemade signs and any revote signs you may have. The greater the attendance, the greater the message!
Please remember that this is a PEACEFUL rally as we are a PEACEFUL Party!
The three other election reform public meetings scheduled in other cities for later this month are listed here

Posted by Stefan Sharkansky at February 09, 2005 11:37 PM | Email This
Comments
1. I'll be there.
Verify citizenship when registering.
Show ID when voting.

Posted by: north clark county on February 9, 2005 11:45 PM
2. AARGH! Two minutes drive from my house in Vancouver... and I'm living halfway around the world! I'm there in spirit. Wish I could be there in the flesh.

-------------------------------------
Our Voice Will Not Be Silenced

Posted by: JRR on February 9, 2005 11:55 PM
3. Revote Rally / Election Reform Meeting in Vancouver

AARGH! There can't be a revote.

See judge Bridge's latest order and the Washington State Constitution.

Posted by: Erik on February 10, 2005 02:42 AM
4. The whole thing is just a sham, as believable as your old-time Western traveling show that pushed miracle cures and magic elixirs guaranteed to cure what ails ya.

It is to Reed's discredit that he agreed to take on this showboat of a "commission", and be Fraudoire's Commissar. Fraudoire isn't going to sign off on anything that diminishes the opportunity to commit fraud. Since Fraudoire's comrades control both houses of the legislature, they are not going to pass anything that endangers their hold on power.

This is all just for show, to lend Fraudoire an air of credibility ("Look, we're doing something!"). Don't fall for it, Washingtonians. Denounce Fraudoire, Commissar Reed, and their phony "commission" at every opportunity.

Posted by: Interested Observer on February 10, 2005 05:46 AM
5. Erik, actually Judge Bridges said that he wouldn't order a revote. That doesn't mean that he won't throw out the election, and then we have to vote again to elect a governor in November. What's that? A new vote, seems to be a revote to me. Although, I think the rules may change a little. Also, it could be that a higher court orders the revote on appeal.

Just a thought.

Jim

Posted by: Jim in Clark County on February 10, 2005 06:08 AM
6. “The problems that have occurred during the 2004 election cycle are unacceptable and need to be fixed,” said Reed. (this from the link of meeting dates and places)


Now doesn't this SAY it ALL....Reed admiting "unacceptable". Is he saying we shouldnt accept the "new Guv", I read it that way.

Posted by: Chris on February 10, 2005 06:39 AM
7. Interested Observer--
While what you say may be true, ignoring the meetings makes it self-fulfilling. If enough people show enough concern to show up and participate by making cogent statements, at some point the Ds recognize they ignore the people at their own peril. The Ds might be liberal, but their not stupid. Especially those who remember 1994 after they did ignore the voices of the people. The voters in 1994 mader sure to put them someplace where it didn't matter that they wouldn't listen: out of office.

Chris--
Because of his position, Sam Reed can't come right out and state his position on the former attorney general. However, based on his office's position in legal briefs in the election contest, he was much more supportive of the Rossi position than the WSDCC position. It a matter of reading between the lines. Sam is not an obstacle in this. Given enough public support, he will help push for even more election reform.

Posted by: north clark county on February 10, 2005 07:44 AM
8. The problem is... the Democrats literally want every vote to count... and that includes as many illegal votes as they can round up. If they really wanted only legitimate votes to count they would support ID at the polls and proof of citizenship to register... but they won't, and never will unless forced to do so by the people they say they represent.

Posted by: Tucker on February 10, 2005 07:59 AM
9. Just some suggestions for signs,

Here are the signs that would have the biggest impact:

What about the Felon Votes?

What about the Cadaver votes?

What about the Extra ballots?

What about the Illegal Votes?

What about the Cover-up?

What about the Military Votes?

What about My Vote?

What about the Lies from
Logan, Sims, Reed, Gregoire?

Posted by: Son of Liberty on February 10, 2005 08:00 AM
10. Election reform will not be accomplished by pursuing only the issue of election reform. Determining what needs to be done is the easy part. The battle has to be to link the corrupt elections system to the Democrats who fight reform at every turn. Until Democrats are out of power, our election system will never be reformed.

Posted by: Mike on February 10, 2005 08:19 AM
11. This is also an opportunity to make a big statement for a revote.

Perhaps via a protest outside the meeting (that is your right), but please allow the meeting to focus on the purpose of the meeting: election reform!

Posted by: Daniel K on February 10, 2005 08:21 AM
12. Get a life, you lost, nobody cares except a few sore loser Republicans.

Posted by: name on February 10, 2005 08:23 AM
13. The three other election reform public meetings scheduled in other cities for later this month are listed here

Des Moines, Pasco, Spokane? Why not Seattle or somewhere on the northside?

Posted by: Daniel K on February 10, 2005 08:27 AM
14. If you are going to attend, consider printing a copy of Evergreen Freedom Foundations paper titled:

EFF's Election Reform Recommendations to the Legislature

The link to the site is on the list on the right side of this page. Pick out a few points you like the best and sign up to make a statement. Repetition in these situations can be effective.

Posted by: ctmohr on February 10, 2005 08:42 AM
15. Congress is holding investigative hearings right now on the voting irregularities that occurred in Ohio. I'm sure that you will want to follow this story since you're interested only in fairness, honesty, and accoracy in electoral politics.

Posted by: headless lucy on February 10, 2005 09:13 AM
16. name,

I heard your cries in the 2000 election, I heard your foul mouths in 2004, get over it name, your loosing ground, fast. Try Canada.

Posted by: Son of Liberty on February 10, 2005 09:15 AM
17. Lucy,

Get a life. What say we focus on the CLOSEST races in the country?

We'd be most concerned with - SURPRISE - the Gubernatorial election in Washington. Gee, go figure.

After that, we'd probably look to WISCONSIN, where Kerry won by 11,300 votes, and there is evidence of MASS fraud and corruption in Milwaukee.

Sometime, oh, maybe next century, we'd finally get around to Ohio where Bush trounced Kerry by over one hundred grand.

Your mistake with 'accoracy' is quite cute, though.

But I think we're all interested in our own back yard, so we won't be dropping the ball on this stolen election in Washington any time soon - much to your chagrin.

Posted by: Larry on February 10, 2005 09:22 AM
18. are they kidding me with this? the seattle rally is planend for vealentine's day? now I know that King County bleeds blue, but it also stands to reason that given the greater population of King co, the more unhappy campers there are. Oh, and the fact that those of us from king co who voted Rossi have been categorically disenfranchised.

Anyone else suspect that the scheduling of this event on valentine's day is a method of supressing turnout?

Posted by: dpmiv on February 10, 2005 09:24 AM
19. And why is it in Vancouver? Nothing against Vancouver, but don't we have a Capitol in Olympia with lots of expensive new buildings for meetings like this? Or is this just an attempt to keep large crowds of demonstrators away from the serious business of hiding the truth? If so, here are a few suggestions for future "out of the way" meeting sites for Fraudoire's task force. How about "Antelope WA", or "Clarno WA", or what about "Havillah WA"?

Posted by: Scott on February 10, 2005 09:34 AM
20. headless lucy,

Sure, let's find out what happened. I am interested only in fairness, honesty, and accoracy in all electoral politics. Any political party, and elected offical, any election should be checked for wrong doing and then if there is cheating, fraud, political muscle used to defraud the voters, than hit them with the law and kick them out. Show proof, show them the door. But stop crying about it. You lost your head from blind hatred, untolerant of differences of opinions, and the sting of so many losses in the past. Get over it. Moveon.girl

Posted by: Son of Liberty on February 10, 2005 09:36 AM
21. I hope the "dead guy" who was shown in the Seattle Times holding the cardboard "I Voted in King County" sign shows up Feb 10th.

Name-"Nobody cares..." Obviously you care about something or you wouldn't be reading Sound Politics. I'm sure it must be frightening to know that your party has proven itself to be nothing more than raw sewage which cheats, lies, discriminates, makes immature comments that don't have any basis or meaning, etc... and is slowly diminishing. PS. I'll be more then happy to help you move to Canada

Posted by: Cameron on February 10, 2005 09:46 AM
22. Three thoughts.

1. The Federal Reserve handles about 80 billion transactions annually, 36 billion of them are paper checks. This far exceeds the number of ballots processed in Washington State in the same time period.

Failures in the range of 1 per million would be a nightmare. That's 220 million transactions per day, including 100 million checks, all reconciled and reported by the end of each day. The failure rate in the recent election was about two per thousand.

The banking system's requirements for transparency, confidentiality, authenticity, accuracy, and timeliness are comparable or exceed the needs of an election system.

The commission should contract experts from the financial industry to find out how they do this, and participate in the design of a robust election system.

2. The US military has communication systems which identify and authenticate operators and mobile transmitters end-to-end over large distances and in real time.

Though encryption technology messages can be "sealed" to all but the intended recipient and digitally "signed", with an authenticable and non-repudiatable identity that prevents message tampering.

The commission should recommend a pilot program with the US department of defense for transmitting and processing electronic absentee ballots.

3. We have heard the head of at least one election department state that their emphasis is on making elections accessible to all, and that challenging illegal registration and voting is the citizen's responsibility.

Allowing an illegal vote is a disenfranchisement of a legal vote to the same degree as denying that legal vote in the first place.

The election system should be required to give equal emphasis to both forms of disenfranchisement.

Posted by: Chuck Dermody on February 10, 2005 09:53 AM
23. Son of Liberty: "Moveon.girl"
I think H. Lucy is actually a "boy," not that it matters to anyone, including H.L. him/herself.

Posted by: JG on February 10, 2005 09:54 AM
24. JG,
You sure? Lucy carries on like my liquored-up liberal neighbor headless Pelosi.

Posted by: Son Of Liberty on February 10, 2005 10:13 AM
25. I'm sorry, but this task force thing is a bunch of hooey. She needs a task force to make recommendations? Her discernment skills are sorely lacking.

X-tine, save the loot and just call me. I'll tell you exactly what's needed. Prove citizenship upon registration. ID at the polls. Create a working state felon list that counties can easily check. Change color, size of provisionals. Delete dead people from the rolls right away. Stop double-voters. Make it illegal to vote if the voter actually TELLS the precinct worker they are not registered (I have to even SUGGEST this???) And make it illegal to vote for WA candidates whose last name start with "G". (JUST KIDDING--just trying to see if you're paying attention)

Posted by: Michele S on February 10, 2005 10:20 AM
26. Michele S,
YES! These are all things I have been suggesting as well as many others. And they make sense to fixing the problems we had.
What will we get instead of the reforms you and I and others mention? A state of the art election facility (hopefully it will have a huge art budget) and more training for workers!

GREAT!

Posted by: Joe on February 10, 2005 10:28 AM
27. Son Of Liberty:"You sure?"
No. The only thing I am sure of is that this election was a mess in King County, and smells like incompetence and fraud.

Posted by: JG on February 10, 2005 10:34 AM
28. You all cry like wounded little girls when someone calls you a "bad name". You should read your own posts and review the frequent and lowdown shmack that you gratuitously hurl at anyone who dares question you. You are not individuals, but members of a neo-con groupthink sewing circle. You are small, mean-spirited losers. And when you win you're gloating, loudmouthed braggarts.

Posted by: headless lucy on February 10, 2005 10:35 AM
29. AND you're a Son of Something, but it isn't Liberty!

Posted by: headless lucy on February 10, 2005 10:37 AM
30. Headless Churchill,

Truth is truth do you not understand, the numbers don't add up, too many "headless" voters

Posted by: Terry, Clark C on February 10, 2005 10:44 AM
31. I understand that the US Attorney has still not considered King County distributed fraud situation not on his radar screen to warrant an investigation, as mentioned by Carlson on KVI yestereday. Not to say that this won't happen eventually. The new election facility and the training of election workers is King County's way of trying to sweep this problem under the carpet by throwing more taxpayer money at it - the liberal way..(efficiency doesn't matter) so they would feel good. Needless to say, that pervasive attitude sucks !

I wish that Shark would make the audio clip available on this blog; with Sims making the pronouncement about Banks being proud of the KC Elections reord 99.98% (really 99.8%)followed by sharp laughter - almost as good as the Dean scream...

Posted by: KS on February 10, 2005 10:44 AM
32. Is this so-called reform task force accepting written comments from members of the public?

Or is this just another meaningless meeting to give people a chance to vent their spleens before the people who are unfortunately in charge do what they were planning to do anyway?

The report is supposed to be submitted by the first of March, so if they were going to accept written comments it seems they would have publicized that fact by now.

I haven't found any such notice.

Has anyone else?

Posted by: Micajah on February 10, 2005 10:46 AM
33. Headless,

Liberty is for all, freedom of speach is for all too, and thank Stefan this public message board 'blog' is open to all. I enjoy all points of interest, even yours. If I cut too deep, I am sorry. If the pounding in heart is from fear of loosing yet another election, see your cardiologist, you'll be needing a jumpstart soon. As the truth keeps marching on to REVOTE Time. See you at the voting booth.

Posted by: Real Son of Liberty on February 10, 2005 10:56 AM
34. Actually found the video clip that only played the laughter - not Sims's phony lecture about "home manners" or whatever, which is Soviet style. I heard the audio clip on KVI and KTTH this morning - Stefan was one of the well-timed laughs.

If Sims gets reelected, its because there are too many voters with their collective heads where the sun don't shine and badly need re-education. Oh, the collective ignorance of the Seattle masses !

Posted by: KS on February 10, 2005 11:04 AM
35. You all cry like wounded little girls when someone calls you a "bad name". You should read your own posts and review the frequent and lowdown shmack that you gratuitously hurl at anyone who dares question you. You are not individuals, but members of a neo-con groupthink sewing circle. You are small, mean-spirited losers. And when you win you're gloating, loudmouthed braggarts.


Posted by headless lucy at February 10, 2005 10:35 AM [Lucy, I want you to know I have a very ID card with a very low number in the VRWC. In addition, I hope voter fraud becomes a capital offense, as I want to help deliver the sentences.] JCH On The Big Island Of Hawaii

Posted by: J. C. Herman on February 10, 2005 11:21 AM
36. The neo-libs are the loudmouthed braggarts when they win here and invented groupthink, as is the case in the welfare state of Hawaii, which is at least as progressive as WA.. So blah, blah, blah.

Posted by: KS on February 10, 2005 11:26 AM
37. "corrupt elections system to the Democrats who fight reform at every turn."

I really must take exception with that. Besides Washington state, the only people working for electoral reform are Democrats and "third parties". I don't think I've seen ANY Repub names attached to reform anywhere else. I hope I'm wrong.

"Anyone else suspect that the scheduling of this event on valentine's day is a method of supressing turnout?"

Damn, now that's some tin foil hattery.

"The commission should recommend a pilot program with the US department of defense for transmitting and processing electronic absentee ballots."

I agree with this, but it must be done right. I can see it opening a whole new can of worms. I think we should focus on fixing the points of failure that exist before adding "new features", but this is a great idea if the Govt. would carry it out properly.

"liberal neighbor headless Pelosi."

That's the 2nd liberal/Pelosi comment I've seen in 2 days. She's much more moderate than liberal.

"ID at the polls."

Is this not state wide? I had to provide ID at the polls and I proved proof of citizenship (through SS) when registering.

"sweep this problem under the carpet by throwing more taxpayer money at it - the liberal way"

I think regardless they'll need to use more tax money to implement some of the necessary changes, but certainly efficiency needs to be addressed first.

Everyone here still seems to be very excited about this being fraud. I still don't feel fraud's been shown. Irregularities and at least a semi-broken system, yes. I have to agree with that. What specifically urges you guys forward with fraud? Anything in particular or just the general mistrust of Dems here combined with the irregularities?

Posted by: Losing Faith on February 10, 2005 11:36 AM
38. Hey -- what's this meeting -- in Des Moines??? on Monday the 14th - Valentine's Day during dinner hours -- what a load of p-ant crap -- when's the meetings in Lyynwood, Bellevue, West Seattle, Ballard - Everett, Bellingham -- etc etc etc why only Vancouver, Spokane, Pasco and Des Moines -- damn cowards -- oh wait - I just remembered - actually the chance of getting any positive input on voting process improvements from anyone in Seattle is not too likely.

Posted by: Bill on February 10, 2005 11:39 AM
39. D'oh forgot some stuff.

How is it that Rossi thinks a revote is still possible? Didn't the judge say he'd either put Rossi in office or not put Rossi in office (leaving CG)? I don't think the power for a revote exists anywhere in Washington law.

Posted by: Losing Faith on February 10, 2005 11:40 AM
40. "actually the chance of getting any positive input on voting process improvements from anyone in Seattle is not too likely."

I'm in Seattle. I want reform.

Posted by: Losing Faith on February 10, 2005 11:44 AM
41. Losing Faith,
Actually when you showed your SS number as ID it wasn't proof of citizenship it was just a method of assuring that you were who you say you are. There is no checking for citizenship in this state for voter registration. It is the "Honor system"

Posted by: Joe on February 10, 2005 11:49 AM
42. Losing Faith,

Your comment about Pelosi being moderate is laughable at best. Maybe she's moderate compared to the rest of the Democrats - Kerry, Kennedy, Kucinich, Dean, Sharpton. But when compared with all of America, mainstream red-and-blue country, she is Liberal with a capital 'L'.

As for fraud, we really won't know until all the parties involved are deposed at the trial, and the public is allowed to 'discover' all the emails from King County. But fraud is not the standard that must be met in this case anyway.

There are many Republicans who want voting reform. However, most of the shenanigans that happen are in Democratic districts with Democratic officials, so it is hard to get any traction. Want proof? Look at Seattle/King County this year. How about the problems being uncovered in Milwaukee, where Kerry won Wisconsin state by only 11,300? If you look at Ohio, you'll see problems in Cuyahoga County (Cleveland - surprise, surprise!) The problems by nature happen in large urban areas with diverse populations and crowded precincts. These are usually Democratic. So a Republican who wants reform has to stick his or her nose into King Ron Sims fiefdom.

Posted by: Larry on February 10, 2005 11:57 AM
43. I'm going. I'll be leaving Redmond 2:30 thereabouts. I have a single open seat and would be happy for the company.

Posted by: Chuck Dermody on February 10, 2005 12:04 PM
44. Did you see King Ron's eyes glass over when Stephan asked him what the "numerator and denominator" were? He looked as if he had just been given an algebra 101 test he forgot to study for!

Posted by: Scott on February 10, 2005 12:04 PM
45. Erik, actually Judge Bridges said that he wouldn't order a revote. That doesn't mean that he won't throw out the election, and then we have to vote again to elect a governor in November.

What's that?

That would be a new election in 11/2006 in which any and interested candidates would run again including those who were not in the last election.

If Rossi is successful in the contest, Brad Owen will have been the governor for 18 months. Look to him to try to retain the position. Also look for other republicans to run. Yes, and a Libertarian candidate.

However, in the new election, only the top two will proceed to the final.

A "re-vote" on the other hand would only have the last slate of candidates that were in the general election. The original revote was requested for Spring of 2005.

Posted by: Erik on February 10, 2005 12:09 PM
46. Erik,

The constitution was amended in 1910 to provide for an election to fill a vacancy in the governor's office.

The resulting Article III, section 10 language says:

... and if a vacancy occur more than thirty days before the next general election occurring within two years after the commencement of the term, a person shall be elected at such election to fill the office of governor for the remainder of the unexpired term." [Emphasis added.]

The constitution has required, since 1910, that the vacancy be filled at the "next general election," yet you say that the earliest possible general election is not the next general election, but is instead the one that comes after the next general election.

The next general election is November 2005.

You say a vacancy cannot be filled until the general election that occurs in the following year -- November 2006.

What part of "next general election" is so hard to understand?

Posted by: Micajah on February 10, 2005 12:19 PM
47. Can somebody tell me what Sam Reed certified???? Did he certify that the election actually happened? (IF so anybody could do that...) What does certify mean in regards to certifying an election? All three elections in my opinion were to close to certify... I don't get it....

Posted by: Carl on February 10, 2005 12:24 PM
48. What part of "next general election" is so hard to understand?

None of it.

However, you may want to check the section of the constitution that concerns the election of a governor.

Posted by: Erik on February 10, 2005 12:29 PM
49. headless lucy,

All during lunch I thought about you. You must have heard, “Never bring a knife to a gun fight.” So I say to you, if you’re going to share ideas and points of view, don’t get hurt when someone stands firm and fires back. Look, even a half-wit will come to understand that touching a hot stove over and over again, that something is wrong there. This election is hot and we need to find out what’s cooking inside. It just doesn’t add up, fairly.

It’s been a long slow turn to the right for me politically. I‘ve lived all over the world working as a photojournalist. After 23 years ‘out there’ seeing and hearing all kinds of vile crap about the USA, I wish I could tattoo the Declaration of Independence, The Constitution and the Bill of Rights all over my body. America is GREAT. Americans are wonderful people. And we always fight for what is right. We even fight each other, not for dominance but for equal Rights. And when any politician or any political party tries to cheat our vote away from us, ‘There will be gun smoke in the air’.

Now you‘ve read the findings, you’ve seen their reaction, thing just don’t add up headless boy/girl! I’d like answers and a real honest vote, no matter who wins. And who ever is behind this, heads (less) will roll. Nothing personal.

Posted by: Son of Liberty on February 10, 2005 12:30 PM
50. Son of Liberty:

Thank you for your post. My swing to the right was sudden and painful...9/11. I was just as 'headless' as Lucy ... I even voted for Clinton and then for Gore. But I have seen the light. I guess I'm one of those horrible "neocons" that she talks about (I don't even know if anyone knows the actual definition of that word).

All I know is that I'm MUCH happier now and feel much more at ease with the world. It's not perfect, but it's what we have to work with.

Thank you for your positive message. :-)

Posted by: megs on February 10, 2005 12:35 PM
51. Scott,
It was most likely Algebra 99.

Posted by: SnoCo Voter on February 10, 2005 12:41 PM
52. Notice how the meeting in King County is scheduled on Valentine's Day, when turnout is likely to be less....

Posted by: Michele S on February 10, 2005 12:48 PM
53. Erik,

Been there, done that.

What's your point?

Article III, section 1 provides for the regular election of governors.

Article III, section 10 provides for the election of a person to fill a vacancy in the governor's office.

The latter clearly states that the vacancy shall be (meaning "must be" -- no discretion is authorized) filled at the next general election.

The next general election (unless you believe this case is going to drag on into October) is the one scheduled for November 2005.

Posted by: Micajah on February 10, 2005 12:51 PM
54. Carl

Sam Reed did not certify the election of the governor.

He has no authority to certify that election.

The legislature certified the election of the governor without first deciding the contested election.

The certificate of election was issued by the speaker of the house and president of the senate on Jan. 11, 2005.

That certificate stated: "This is to Certify, That at the General Election held in the State of Washington on November 2, 2004, Christine Gregoire received the highest number of votes for the office of Governor of said state of Washington, and was therefore duly elected to said office as appears from the official returns of said election as canvassed and certified in the manner provided by law."

The returns to which the certificate refers are the returns canvassed and certified by the county election officers.

Sam Reed signed that certificate as a witness to the signatures of Brad Owen and Frank Chopp. The latter two men issued the certificate, and therefore the latter two men certified the election of Gregoire after supposedly giving a chance to the joint session of the legislature to take up the matter of the contested election.

It is a common misconception -- reflected in the statements of legislators and even in the petition to recall Reed -- that the SecState certified the results of the gubernatorial election.

He did not, because that isn't his responsibility.

Posted by: Micajah on February 10, 2005 12:59 PM
55. Irony?
Hypocrisy?
Just too funny!

You all cry like wounded little girls when someone calls you a "bad name". You should read your own posts and review the frequent and lowdown shmack that you gratuitously hurl at anyone who dares question you. You are not individuals, but members of a neo-con groupthink sewing circle. You are small, mean-spirited losers. And when you win you're gloating, loudmouthed braggarts. -Posted by headless lucy at February 10, 2005 10:35 AM

Let's review..
HL says:
"You should read your own posts and review the frequent and lowdown shmack that you gratuitously hurl at anyone who dares question you."

AND HL also says:
"You are not individuals, but members of a neo-con groupthink sewing circle. You are small, mean-spirited losers. And when you win you're gloating, loudmouthed braggarts."

The scariest part of that is that he/she sees absolutely NO DISCONNECT between her complaint OF a behavior and the fact that she blithely perpetrates the SAME behavior.

That hypocritical disconnect is one of my favorite forms of liberal amusement.

Thanks HL.

Posted by: Cheryl on February 10, 2005 01:06 PM
56. Liberals everywhere read this:

Politics

Congressman: Democrat Leadership Threatening 'Retribution' for Dems Who Cooperate with White House
by Allan H. Ryskind
Posted Feb 10, 2005

Rep. Paul Ryan (R.-Wis.) was asked at a CATO conference in Washington yesterday whether he had persuaded any Democrats to back his plan to rescue Social Security from its financial troubles. Under his legislation (HR 4851), no new taxes would be needed to pay for "transition costs," participation in the new system would be voluntary and individuals would be allowed to divert a portion of their payroll tax into a mutual fund.

A questioner from the audience, stressing his own Democratic credentials, said he believed Ryan's plan should attract members of his own party and wondered whether the Wisconsin lawmaker had secured any Democratic sponsors. Ryan said he had been working with friends on the "other side of the aisle" who were favorable toward his solution, but he faced an enormous problem: intense pressure on his colleagues from the minority leadership.

"We were in planning stages [with friendly Democrats]," said Ryan. But each essentially told him: "I like what you're doing. I like this bill. I think it's the right way to go. But my party leadership will break my back. The retribution that they are promising us is as great as I have ever seen. We can't do it."

Ryan said he believed the only thing that can assure passage is an outpouring from America's grassroots.


This is what your party looks like to the rest of the country. And here in Washington. This blog is the grassroots.

Posted by: Son of Liberty on February 10, 2005 01:24 PM
57. Isn't there a way to do a rally a little closer to Bellingham? :) There's just no way for a lowly collegian like to go all that distance! I'll be there in spirit if that counts for anything

Posted by: Mark on February 10, 2005 01:59 PM
58. Son of Liberty, the national Dem party is imploding. Just in the last few weeks there have been dozens of articles/editorials about that very issue - articles written by devoted Liberals, Conservatives and mid-roaders. They (the dems) do not have a message because they want to be for everything for everyone and hence end up being nothing at all. They have Kerry and Clinton "softening" their image on this, that and the other, then they proceed to pick one of the most uber-libs to run the party. They have yet to realize they can't "dress up" for an issue in order to convince people they are actually for the issue. They don't know who they are, nor do I think they care who they are - they are only interested in who people PERCEIVE they are in order to gain power.

Repairing the Democratic Tent
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A12488-2005Feb9.html

Calling All Democrats
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/10/opinion/10friedman.html?th

Toward a Democratic Purpose
http://www.democracycorps.com/reports/analyses/Toward_a_Democratic_Purpose.pdf

A Suicidal Selection
http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-chait4feb04,0,4875373,print.column?coll=la-news-comment-opinions

Swinging, missing
http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2005/02/08/swinging_missing/

Bad News Donkeys
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A3604-2005Feb6.html

Is Dean the best medicine for what ails Democrats?http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/editorial/outlook/3030529

Dem blues
Can the Democrats find the lyrics to regain the White House?

http://www.usnews.com/usnews/issue/050214/usnews/14dems.htm

Dean 'The Scream' is Dem gravedigger
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ideas_opinions/story/278145p-238331c.html

The scale of rhetoric, the balance of power
http://www.newsday.com/news/opinion/ny-vppin044133781feb04,0,1614180.column?coll=ny-viewpoints-headlines

Anti-Powerfulism
http://www.techcentralstation.com/020805F.html

Howard Dean and the Democrats
http://www.ashbrook.org/publicat/oped/busch/05/dean-dnc.html

The Endless Party
What do Democrats stand for? The real question is, what do they stand against?

http://www.claremont.org/writings/crb/winter2004/voegeli.html

The 'Exit Strategy' Democrats
http://www.opinionjournal.com/editorial/feature.html?id=110006243

Will the Truman Democrats Please Stand Up...
...if there are any left.

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/005/237zmjkl.asp

Dean as DNC Head Means Democrats Admit to Having No New Ideas
http://www.humaneventsonline.com/article.php?id=6544

The Left's Old-Time '60s Political Religion
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/Commentary/com-2_9_05_AB.html

The Dems' Week from Hell
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/005/229fpvkg.asp

Disaster Response
http://www.tnr.com/doc.mhtml?pt=BnkqsRCTTFFwgYk7qTW38R%3D%3D

Remember Sam Rayburn
http://www.washtimes.com/op-ed/20050202-102009-3618r.htm


Posted by: Cheryl on February 10, 2005 02:15 PM
59. I also think that the very opinions/lamentations expressed in those articles are the exact reason the uber-libs are so rabid about this Rossi election contest and so entrenched with Gregoire, despite having voted against her in grand numbers. WA is currently their last best hope at relevancy and they are terrified.

Posted by: Cheryl on February 10, 2005 02:52 PM
60. I find it more than a little ironic that the conservative farming communities of Eastern WA owe their livlihood to a dam that was built by the Works Progress Administration in the 1930's under the aegis of FDR's Presidency. Can you people even connect the dots?

Posted by: headless lucy on February 10, 2005 04:18 PM
61. I'll be there tonight. I'll report back afterwards.

Posted by: Josh Poulson on February 10, 2005 04:46 PM
62. Headless - connect the dots - what's your point ?
So a Democrat president in a way bygone era built the dams in E. WA, predominantly conservative - a random act in the universe. To try and connect any dots is utter dysfunctional nonsense ! Thought you'd push some buttons, huh.

Posted by: KS on February 10, 2005 09:07 PM
63. But Lucy, now the Dems in this state want to tear down that dam!

Posted by: Michele S on February 10, 2005 09:32 PM
64. Okay, I'm back. Trip report is here.

Posted by: Josh Poulson on February 10, 2005 09:38 PM
65. This'll probably never be read, since the thread is so old now (by blog standards), so I'll keep it short. The excerpt from the speech by Rep Ryan proves nothing. All it proves is that he said that. Just because he said it, doesn't make it true.

Posted by: Losing Faith on February 14, 2005 06:56 AM
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