May 13, 2005
Sewer of Corruption(VI)

Christine Gregoire repays another campaign debt:

Gov. Former Attorney General Christine Gregoire greeted some of her strongest supporters in Spokane on Thursday night and announced her plans to sign a bill Monday that could lead to an overhaul of how the state allocates money for education.

Gregoire was in town for a convention of the Washington Education Association.

The bill initiates a $1.7 million study of how the state pays for public education, including preschool, K-12 and higher education. Pro-education organizations like the WEA have pushed for this kind of study for years.

Calling the WEA "pro-education" is like calling the National Cattlemen's Beef Association "pro-cattle", so I can only imagine the horrors that the Gregoire/WEA education spending overhaul will lead to.

Posted by Stefan Sharkansky at May 13, 2005 05:04 PM | Email This
Comments
1. NO! Say it isn't so.... More money being wasted on studies that do nothing to solve the problems. The very definition of insanity!
Doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.

Posted by: mimi on May 13, 2005 05:36 PM
2. More money for "guvment" employees! Along with felons, union hacks, and welfare losers, I think we have listed the backbone of the Democrat Party.

Posted by: JCH on May 13, 2005 06:06 PM
3. $1.7mm to study how to re-shuffle the same deck? Problem is, we are playing cards with a marked deck. Game is fixed. What will it matter?

I say ask the Evergreen Freedom Found. and get some REAL reform recommendations. Audit the school districts. Hold people accountable for "Why Johnny can't read." Fire them for goofing up or waste.

Cut the layers of Olympia bureaucrats sitting around on their doughnut-reservoirs. Give the good (effective) teachers the bonuses for REAL RESULTS.

Posted by: Jimmie-howya-doin on May 13, 2005 06:07 PM
4. Hmm.. sounds a lot like one of the bills singled out by the Spokesman-Review as being part of the 98 "emergencies." An emergency to study something. Astounding.

Posted by: RookieRick on May 13, 2005 06:08 PM
5. And speaking of the "emergencies" - here's the text of a letter I just sent to my local paper. I encourage you (especially those of you on the west side) to do likewise.


98 EMERGENCIES; a real eye-opener.

I wonder how many voters are aware that their so-called "representatives" in Olympia attached an emergency clause to 98 of the recently passed measures (ref: www.effwa.org).

I wonder how many voters are aware that their so-called "representatives" do this as a defensive mechanism. And what is it defense against? You, the voter. An "emergency" act is not subject to referendum, and cannot be repealed without the full force of a citizen's initiative.

I wonder why they feel empowered to trample over the explicitly stated will of the people (for example, I-601) in such brazen fashion.

Most importantly, I wonder if enough voters will remember this in the next election, and remind those "representatives" just who they work FOR, and from whom they are loaned, not given, that power.

I wonder.

Posted by: RookieRick on May 13, 2005 06:28 PM
6. This is a good story to follow. Let's find out who gets the $$$ for the study. What qualifications do the consultants hold? Are they the same educators and administrators who cite research into better paid teachers equating to better students? Then I hope they can explain why foreign students from poor countries like China where teachers are poorly paid can generate such better results. Maybe if our teachers spent a little more time with the basics and less trying to get funding for the soft subjects and creative studies programs, then we'd be able to put out students who can compute, read and write.

Posted by: Elvis is the King County on May 13, 2005 06:54 PM
7. 1.7 Million!!???? WTF???? We need a 1.7 million study for the state to study how the state funds public schools.

What I am I missing? The State and local gov't budgets, taxes and spends educations funds. And the they need a study to find out what's going on?!!!

Don't the have a spare budget document laying around the Former Att. General's Office? She can't look up the education spending. Isn't there an accounting office, pick up the phone and ask for the education budget?

Sign me up for this job! 1.7 mil to go through the budget and pull up the educations sections.

Of all the moronic, imbecilic, brain dead ideas this one is way up scale. 1.7 mil for a study for state spending program that should be a known quantity is ludicrous.

Are they finally admitting they are so FUBARed in Oly that the need a study to find our money? Just admitting they need a study to figure out the education budget tells me Bergeson and the entire accounting section over at education should be fired for incompetence.

Calling for a study to find out how the state is spending tax dollars is a tacit admission either complete and utter incompetence or criminal negligence.

Two words:

PERFORMANCE AUDITS

Posted by: JCM on May 13, 2005 06:58 PM
8. Calling the WEA "pro-education" is like calling the National Cattlemen's Beef Association "pro-cattle", so I can only imagine the horrors that the Gregoire/WEA education spending overhaul will lead to.

Its terrible. I hear that they are proposing to continue to have publically funded schools. They might even teach evolution there.

Posted by: Erik on May 13, 2005 08:30 PM
9. Just yesterday, my son's school had a year-end music program. He is in the third grade. They spent half of the year studying "Native American" cultures. Therefore, the program was their chance to show the dances they learned.

They spent the first half of the year studying salmon. And last year, they spent most of their time studying the "rain forest". I wonder what is in store for next year. Advanced tree hugging?

How in the world can possibly expect our children to compete? Whatever happened to the 3R's? This county is displacing our technology workers as fast as it can by giving out H-1B visas to just about anybody in India that wants one. Meanwhile, our own children are increasingly ignorant in subjects such as math and science.

If we want our children to be competitive, we have got to stop with this "white guilt" crap and get back to basics.

As for me, I do my best to make up for the public school system deficiencies when I am home with the kids. We spend time learning together. And every now and then we play hooky to go somewhere like the Pacific Science Center.

The WEA has got to be taken down. Be it school vouchers or something else, their days are numbered.

Posted by: Mr. Grabbit on May 13, 2005 09:09 PM
10. Erik

It isn't education, just a method to funnel money to the WEA. A percentage of which funds are faithfully returned to the Dems. The only losers are the students and their parents.

But, hey. If you think the current approach to government-funded education is doing so well, that's great. Bad for the state and country, but ok for those of us who send our kids to private schools. Reduces the competition.

Posted by: iconoclast on May 13, 2005 09:21 PM
11. Every Wednesday night, Grandpa helps our grandson with his homework . . . it's a special ritual for the two of them. The little guy brings math, creative writing, spelling . . . all of the basics that kids are supposed to be learning in school. Meanwhile, I have visited his classroom on several occasions to "help". All I have seen actually being taught is multi-culturalism, political correctness, you name it . . . anything but basic education. They are leaving that to the parents, disguised as homework. No wonder these kids have trouble with the WASL.

During one of the many school vacations, my son and I took his two older boys to Olympia to meet our legislators. We sat down in their offices, and the boys got to discuss "issues" with them. Then one of the aides gave the kids a tour of the capitol building. It was awesome. They learned more that day than in weeks of school, and it was an experience neither of them will ever forget. One of them is from the former Soviet Union, so it was especially enlightening for him.

The younger boy is extremely brilliant, but he has a "special need". He spent K-2 in the Issaquah district, and his needs were extremely well met. He was getting an outstanding education, as public schools go. He is in Lk. WA this year. I am angry on a daily basis about what goes on there. This has been a wasted year for him. And if I hear one more word about "the big bang theory", I'm going to scream. Bring on the vouchers!

Posted by: lksimstrailgrammy on May 13, 2005 09:36 PM
12. Mr. Grabbit,

I hope you are home schooling your child as well, because native indian dances and salmon aren't going to mean squat when your child has to compete to get in to a real university or to compete with other kids educated outside of the public schools that have to slow down and cater to the least common denominator.

When I see the kind of garbage that gets passed off as real education today, I just shudder.

As if a tribal dance is a substitute for learning math, reading and writing skills.

Posted by: Jeff B. on May 13, 2005 09:51 PM
13. At least the Cattlemen are honest. The raise cattle to make a profit. The method of making that profit is to raise cattle in the most efficient manner possible then turn the cows into steaks and sell them to a charter PETA (People Eating Tasty Animals) member like me.

The Public Educracy is purported to be in the business of teaching skulls full of mush the material needed to compete in a global economy. What we get is kids who feel good about themselves, bad about American, and that the world owes them something.

Duh-oh!

Posted by: JCM on May 13, 2005 10:07 PM
14. Listening to Suits the other night, driving home from work..

Lady calls in about how awful it was for her son to have been in bootcamp. (Hell, I doubt it is as awful as it was when I went thru in 1969 in middle of the VN War, USMC).

So, all the while she is talking, I am thinking that the reason it was so difficult for him is that his education had provided no training for either difficulty or disappointment in life.

The prevalent public education system in the US, and likely more predominately in this State, tends to focus on touchy-feely let's all get along-we're one-world-hug the trees-each child is special-there are no losers-sort of an education.

Unless folks wake up and mandate (that means hold their feet to the fire) that education is to prepare students for reality instead of convincing them that life is a party and we'll all just get along and be happy, we're doomed.

Do I sound jaded. Yes. As a teenager ineligble to vote I campaigned in 68 for Goldwater. I've been a registered [R] for nearly 35 years. But I'm about to abandon the Republican party because they have abandoned me. I was asked awhile back why I sent my contributions to revotewa instead of the Wa Republican Party. Well, simply because I can no longer support the party and its inept leadership, the treason of its elected representatives, and its deep ingrained concerned with holding PC over right and wrong. The Democrat Party may be the party of "tax and spend", but the Republican Party is most certainly the party of Excuses.

Hasta la Vista, Mr. Vance. You lost an opportunity and a dedicated conciencious voter. And a few hundred bucks a year. Leadership you ain't got. Excuses, you've got a surplus.

/rant off
/jaded on

MikeF
USMC 1968-1973
USArmy Special Forces 1992-1996
Registerd Republican 1970-2005
US Citizen 1949-2***
Taxpayer 1966-OMG yikes

Posted by: MikeF on May 13, 2005 10:15 PM
15. MikeF--tip of hat to you; thanks for your service;

You hit all primary targets; the whole system needs a boot in the azz; I wondered many times about Vance too--where are today's bulldogs of political yore? no one is growling nor barking; where is the mudslinging? I remember vicious political goons as a kid in Chicago--REAL ones that would BITE; it brought out great exchanges and dirty laundry; everyone was the better for it; papers really investigated things; toes were stepped on; now, it's all one big love fest; the PC obsession will kill us as surely as a bullet;

Posted by: Jimmie-howya-doin on May 13, 2005 10:33 PM
16. MikeF, JCM, Jeff,
You guys are right on the mark. Amazing . . my father, who is 84 and still sharp as a tack, has been talking for years about all the kids with mush for brains because of the public schools. It is a travesty, and our children are being mindlessly led down the path of socialism, one school year at a time. Yes, we needed to be a nation with less prejudice; no, we don't need to embrace every culture in the world. This is America, and our kids need to learn about the values that have made America what is is (well, was).

I wish in my lifetime that I could see my grandchildren attend schools where they learned the things that will help them compete in a global market, the moral values that will hold them in good stead for the rest of their lives, a reverence for our national treasures (think about what they REALLY are), a respect for discipline and accountability (does anybody remember "hacks" from their school days?) and the importance of "one nation, UNDER GOD . . . ."

I'm glad that there are parents out there who agree with my father, with me, and with my adult children. Parents who are appalled about our education system (term loosely used) and have a keen desire to have it return to REAL education, not mush. Keep talking . . . it does my heart good.

Posted by: lksimstrailgrammy on May 13, 2005 10:45 PM
17. Can you believe it? A year long high school class to study the effect of the "60's Generation" on modern American society?

Well, I don't remember that class being offered in my school (early 80's). The 60's only rated a semester or two back then.

Yes kids, an actual class devoted to one generation, over sexed, with peace and dope for all.

No other eras matter to myopic, aging hippies.

Posted by: Splatter on May 13, 2005 10:51 PM
18. 1. Actually, they *don't* know where the education money goes. Some former governor -- Locke? Lowry? not sure -- was asked something like "What was the most embarrassing question you were asked as governor?" And he said it was when someone asked him where all of the education funding went, because he then realized that he actually didn't know. Yes, it takes an Olympian level of incompetence not to know where half of your state budget goes, but did you really think these folks were rocket scientists? Not that a $1.7M study is required to find it. Not that we can't already guess (or that they haven't already written) the conclusion and recommendations of a "study" yet to be performed. Not that it's anything but a political stunt. But, for the record, they really don't know (or care) where the money goes.

2. If they wanted to save $1.7M, they would simply require every school district to submit, under penalty of perjury, a line-item budget of where their money has gone for the past biennium. Each entry would contain all relevant information such as payee, amount, date, cost center, check number, a JPG of the cancelled check, and a *very detailed* description of the nature of the expense and why it was necessary. Penalties for failure to provide sufficient detail would begin with the subtraction of 5X that amount from their next budget, plus an implied invitation for a full audit.

3. And now for something completely different: Ask yourself, "Is it better to live and die, or never to live?" Better, I say, to live and die. Bloody no one keeps cows as household pets. Same with camels. But unlike camels, we drink the milk and eat the meat from cattle, which is why there are millions of them experiencing life in this great country. And only a few dozen camels in zoos. Cattle farming is the reason why cattle have the chance to live. Cattlemen and sensible diners cannot be accused of being anything but pro-cattle.

Posted by: TB on May 13, 2005 10:55 PM
19. Gee, they'll spend almost 2 mil to find out how the state spends on education, but they never wanted to do performance audits otherwise.

Imagine that.

Posted by: Michele on May 13, 2005 10:58 PM
20. And Mr. Grabbit, run--don't walk--to your favorite private school. Because I can tell you right now, you may be in the Lk WA district, but it sure isn't going to get any better any time soon. You are correct that public school is wasting your kid's time. We figured that out after five years in Lk WA District. Now that we have made the switch to private, you couldn't pay us to go back. Our kids are getting a genuinely substantive education; the kind we all thought we were supposed to get in public school but won't ever get there.

Posted by: Michele on May 13, 2005 11:05 PM
21. ...."1.7 million to see how the state pays for education"
Well, they count butts in seats then charge about 7 grand per. That's how they do it. I'll take that 1.7 million in small bills only.

Posted by: PC on May 14, 2005 12:02 AM
22. "Calling the WEA "pro-education" is like calling the National Cattlemen's Beef Association "pro-cattle"

This is a perfect analogy!

Posted by: Deborah on May 14, 2005 12:17 AM
23. Mr. Grabbit: A good education can be had in public schools, but only if you are lucky and know the ropes (and have an inside with an administrator or two)! It's sad, really...My kids have had some very good teachers, but it's not easy to get what you want out of the system as it is.

As to families teaching their own, I say give me a good engineer over a middle-school science teacher any day of the week! I know more parents than ever who are involved in their kids' instruction, and those with a technical background have an edge. If you have even a casual acquaintance with English, you will do a better job of instructing your child in language than many grade school teachers. You know it's bad when your kid corrects his teacher's grammar and spelling.

What's needed to encourage improvement is for public schools to face competition for education dollars. In the absence of performance audits, consumer choice is the best remedy for what ails our schools.

Finally, don't worry about your kids passing the WASL, lksimstrailgrammy. If you look at this test you will recognize that it is not a meaningful measure of academic performance. In fact, I don't think it is worth the paper it is printed on (How many trees gave their lives for the WASL? Although the test includes many "environmentally correct" questions, somehow the issue of WASL paper consumption never comes up...). It really deserves to be deep-sixed so teachers can go back to teaching the basics - instead of devoting such a ridiculous amount of time to cramming for the WASL.

Posted by: PeggyU on May 14, 2005 01:04 AM
24. sad to say it, but the Asians will run you over before you know what happened. They take education seriously.

Posted by: aes on May 14, 2005 01:20 AM
25. An honest study would say two things:

1) Stop trying to feminize boys in public schools.

2) Get rid of the WEA and introduce vouchers and choice within the public school system.

Of course, those two things will never happen. But, it's nice to imagine what it would be like if Washington State really cared about excellence.

Posted by: DeadManVoting (aka Iguana) on May 14, 2005 02:02 AM
26. aes -- they already have -- take a look at Harbor Island - take a look at all your clothes labels, take a look at 80-90% of all the merchandise in any retailer - large or small -- OPEN YOUR EYES-- check out Vancouver BC -- haven't heard a word lately about Long Beach Naval Station == hey -- who's running the Panama Canal -- what;s going on in the Bahama's -- 'The Asians are gonna run over us - what a load -- duh - they been in high gear for 30 years -- and all the craphead polititions - Rep and Dem, are fiddling away -- meanwhile the Southern border is hemmoraging and the BS war on terror is waged more against the ordinary US citizen than against the illegals, the actual perpetrators and all the enemies within - mostly MSM and democraps

Posted by: Bill on May 14, 2005 06:20 AM
27. Christine Haywire is the newly elected political hack for the radical left and unions in Washington State...They just love her. Have you noticed?...her new name should be "hot pen Hanna" for the way she is signing bills as fast as they get them to her!

Posted by: Route101 on May 14, 2005 06:50 AM
28. Christine's new motto is:...."I never met a taxpayer I did'nt like..."

Posted by: Route101 on May 14, 2005 06:56 AM
29. Mr Grabbit asked "Whatever happened to the 3 R's?" Well Mr. Grabbit, OSPI spent another 3 million of your money rewriting them. The project is called "The New 3R's...Skills for the 21st Century"
What are the "New" 3R's?
Relating, Representing and Reasoning
(if you'd like a copy-email me)
And if you all are thinking the WASL tests academic ability of some perceived knowledge...think again. The WASL tests for the new 3R's!
Maybe you all heard. A 4th grader was suspended this week for 5 days in Aberdeen for refusing to answer a question on the WASL. What was the question you ask?
Actually, it was a prompt for a writing assingment. The kids are to dream up a wild story using the following prompt
"You're looking out the window and you see your principal fly by...."
The 4th graders were also told by the teacher "don't worry about your sentence structure, it will stifle your creativity"
Well then, what are they graded on?
Mr Grabbit, they are doing poorly on the WASL because they don't THINK this way.

Posted by: Shalimar on May 14, 2005 07:05 AM
30. I appreciate all of the positive replies to my post. I am so glad we have this forum, because as I sat at my son's school watching this production I kept asking myself if I was the only one who thought it to be totally irrelevant to the task of educating our children. It's good to know that I am not alone.

After I posted, I thought back to when I was my son's age. I will never forget my third grade teacher, Mrs. Brack. She devoted every drop of energy she had to educating us and preparing us for the future. She was a black woman, but not a victim. On the contrary. She carried herself with pride and dignity. And she taught all of us to do the same. She would be the modern-day WEA's worst nightmare.

That year, we all learned to write in cursive. We learned long division. We spent many, many hours studying U.S. history. And I can assure you that there was no monkey business in class. Mrs. Brack was very strict, yet she had a loving touch. Looking back, I understand that I owe her quite a debt. I guess the only way I can repay it is by trying to give my children the same chance.

Michele and Jeff B. brought up private schools and home schooling. And I think you are both right. The Lake Washington district has proven to be nothing more than an unresponsive political machine and an instrument of the WEA. It is a shame that they have our children hostage.

School vouchers may be our only hope.

Posted by: Mr. Grabbit on May 14, 2005 09:12 AM
31. Move over here to the east side of the state.
Small rural towns really do a better job in schools.
I do not need or want Christine Gregoire or an analyst telling me what my children need.
I've said this before on this blog, and I'll say it again and again, it all starts in the home. If parents are not willing to put their children above all else, it is their fault. My husband and I do not have high paying jobs. I drove a 13 year old car and cried when I had to trade it in. My husband drives a 1973 El Camino given to him by my dad. Our three children all worked and bought their own cars. They had chores they did daily. They were not involved in high school sports (gasp!) but FFA and learned numerous life skills there. Say what you will about hicks from the sticks, but we do raise good upstanding republicans, er... I mean citizens!
My oldest daughter is beginning her teaching career and lives over there on the west side. She graduated high school in a class of 54. She did her student teaching at Stadium High School in Tacoma. Upscale yes, but huge to her. She subbed in numerous schools in the Tacoma School District. She saw it all. She is getting her master's and then hopefully her superintendent certificate. She knows these kids need good leaders, good teachers, not more money poured into the system. And she is thrilled with her current beginning teacher's salary.

Posted by: cc on May 14, 2005 03:24 PM
32. "Calling the WEA "pro-education"..."

Wow...with profound statements like this, is it any wonder she lost the election...DOH!

Posted by: flexnfx on May 14, 2005 04:13 PM
33. I heard a national radio talk show host refer to the Democrats as the "sneaky party" and the Republicans as the "stupid party". Pretty accurate if you ask me. I would prefer siding with the underdog (only if they aren't too stupid). The sneaky party is largely corrupt and out of control and the WEA is attached to the body of the "sneaks" - where the motto is throw money at it to solve the problems/without a solid plan ? Sound familiar ? - Check out nonewgastax.com.

Hopefully the Stupid Party will wise up in time for the trial in Chelan County otherwise the sewer of corruption powered by the sneaks will flow on. The next big election will present another opportunity where the stupid party will have a shot at thwarting the sneaky party in this here state !

Posted by: KS on May 14, 2005 08:50 PM
34. Bill,
I totally agree. I don't understand what's going on here, but we all seem to have to be so 'careful'. Not to offend etc.
The Asians are looking to, and teaching, Western values, engineering, skills. There's a shift.
Even in Europe - my mother in an undisclosed European country told me the other day that thankfully the trend of less dicipline in the classroom has been reversed. And my mother is absolutely not part of the right-wing conspiracy. She might just have some good old common sense.

Posted by: aes on May 14, 2005 09:30 PM
35. Grabbit--
God Bless Mrs. Brack's memory. That's exactly what we need today. There MUST be teachers like that around today ready to roll, but held back by unions and silly lawsuits.

I was a product of the Midwest private schools. Paid my own way when I could. The infamous strict nuns who beat the tar out of you. Today their M.O. is surely phys. & psyc. abuse--I do not advocate that Middle Ages method--but the basic desclipline and high expectations are the key.

I also hold parents to task too. They are more concerned with their latest cable program or Amer. Idol hero than their kids' daily school events and how they are subtly being fed political pap. Our school day was all work--the 3 R's--no room for someone's 'feelings.'

"Diversity" back then meant your (diverse) choice of punishments--an immediate whack or a trip to the principal for a whack & a call to your parents at their workplace--gulp!

In any case, bring back the tough "Ms. Brack's" of the world and let parents stand behind them en masse to send a message to the education bureaucrats! Results or else! Fail or jail the miscreants. Send troublemakers to 'boot camp' schools for a lesson about living in society. Other countries will steamroll us in the schools and jobs and we will be left whining at the roadside with our smiley-face "get-along certificates" and tissue diplomas.

Posted by: Jimmie-howya-doin on May 15, 2005 09:13 AM
36. Dead man voting,

I hear what you mean when you say, "Of course, those two things will never happen," referring to the feminization of boys in public schools, the WEA, vouchers, and choice within the public school system.

There is only one way we can avoid more disasterous problems resulting from our current education system.
Local communities must seize control of their own schools away from the unions and the Federal Government. If we do not do this, our country will not last. The left uses our schools as their breeding ground for liberal socialist, communist coercion turning children into punks, whores and morons. Think of Nelson for example. A person who is so steeped in cheap liberal bu22$hit that he has no idea how corrupted he really is.

Thank god there are children like I was that rebel against the system. Many of the them probably felt for some time that they were not as smart as the ones who went along. They are forced to go their own way and think for themselves, and they see right through liberals. Many of them read, study and strive to find the truth amidst the wasteland of liberal media hype and Ted Kennedy logic. They are the smart ones and they will be the ones who will carry the torch of freedom in the future.

Start a community school, hire real teachers and staff, set real standards, and give kids a real chance at learning to function. To hell with the WEA and all that support it.

Posted by: Amused by liberals on May 15, 2005 09:49 AM
37. Hmmm. Question for you folks...No one likes the WASL. Not too many fuzzies here for the WEA, but they also hate the WASL. So, regarding the WASL, shouldn't our enemy's enemy be our friend? There is more chance of repealing the WASL if it is attacked from all sides, particularly if it is a coordinated effort. I'm thinking a statewide teachers' strike combined with an en masse parent movement might instigate some change. Arrange it to happen during the WASL weeks when it won't detract from your child's schooling!

The WASL removed, we turn to the WEA...Each school has a PTO, but is there such a thing as a statewide parent organization? I'm not one for unions, but I think maybe it's time to fight fire with fire. A well organized parent collective with a small, strictly-defined, universally-agreed-upon set of demands could carry some clout and put pressure on poor-performing schools. Schools aren't happy when parents withdraw their children, because they lose the funding that goes with those students. Why did they recently close those schools in King County? Was it due to lack of funds,insufficient enrollment, or something else? It would be worth studying.

Posted by: PeggyU on May 15, 2005 10:27 AM
38. I like the WASL.

The only people who don't like the WASL are people who know little or nothing about it, and lazy a$$ liberal socialist WEA wonks.

It is meant to force teachers to teach basics instead of liberal indoctrination, and students to learn basics. You will hear liberal teachers at length discuss minutae of the WASL condemning it, but it is no more complicated than that.

Local communities need to take back charge of their schools and kick the NEA and the WEA out of the socialist indoctrination business they use our schools to promote.

Posted by: Amused by liberals on May 15, 2005 01:21 PM
39. Shalimar: Would you care to address Amused by liberals? Ummm, sir or madam, you are wrong. That may be what the test is supposed to do, but it is ill-conceived and misses the mark by a light year. I have nothing against standardized tests, and my children have done well on the WASL - so my objections are not based on fear of my kids' failure. I would strongly encourage you to explore it further. Please look into the history of the WASL, the grading process, and the cost of its administration. Please review and critique actual WASL questions. Please, also, be aware that our state legislature recently passed a bill removing nationally-normed tests, such as the inexpensive ITED, from use in Washington student evaluation. What this means is that there is no longer a tool in place to measure the performance of our students against others nationwide. Our students will not know how they stack up until they take SATs or other college approved achievement tests in their junior or senior year of high school.

Posted by: PeggyU on May 15, 2005 03:21 PM
40. Oh Mr./Ms. Amused by Liberals-Where do I begin...
First I suggest you look into the WASL more closely before you support it. There has not been one independent study to date that has been able to deem the WASL valid and reliable in measuring students' acheivement. In fact, the technical reports on OSPI's website say the following about the WASL "Scores from one test given on a single occassion should never be used to make important decisions about students' placement, the type of instruction they receive or retention in a given grade level". Now that the legislature has removed the ITBS testing from the state of Washington, we have no other method for assessing our students with the rest of the country until they take the SAT...and then it's too late! The WASL is not norm-referenced with the rest of the country. It is a home-grown test that no one else in the country is using. The reason OSPI wanted to do away with the ITBS is because it wasn't aligning with the WASL and it was shining a light on all of the WASL's flaws. For example, ITBS scores have shown no marked appreciation over the past several years but the WASL scores have improved dramatically! This phenomenon has caused a lot of people to wonder how that could happen, which has caused a lot of concern and investigation into the WASL. Do your due diligence...the future of our state and your social security depends on it.

Posted by: Shalimar on May 15, 2005 04:57 PM
41. "It is meant to force teachers to teach basics instead of liberal indoctrination, and students to learn basics" Are you out of your flipping mind!!! The WASL is ONLY about LIBERAL INDOCTRINATION!!!!! Where on earth have you been? Now I know you don't have a clue!!!! This is how they are able to do perpetrate this fraud on the people of Washington state like Mr./Ms. Amused by Libererals; they know people like you won't take the time to investigate and rely only on what you hear and are moved by the catchy buzz words.

Here is some BASIC education for you...

8th Grade WASL question...

Chew a 3-gram piece of bubble gum for 15 seconds
Measure the mass of the chewed bubble gum and record
Reapeat steps 1 & 2 for chewing gum
Repeat steps 1,2,and 3 two more times with each type of gum.

Question-How does chewing affect the mass of bubble and chewing gum?

Yep...World-Class standards we have here!!!!

Posted by: Shalimar on May 15, 2005 05:09 PM
42. I have to agree with Shalimar on this one!

The WASL was put into place during the Clinton years. It is incredibly similar to liberal Canada's version...It is NOT a tool for academic measurement - it is a sham!

The WASL's questions are more about measuring *feelings* whereas the ITBS is more about measuring *comprehension* and *application*.
With the current failure rate of the WASL - up to 70% of those taking it will not graduate from high school! Their failure is not due to a lack of math, science, reading skills.....it is more because they can't express their *feelings* correctly in a WASL question! Asking a child to express which *color* fits best with a certain poem...is not a good measurement of that childs ability in the workforce!

The WASL is a liberal/socialist invention to bring our children down to the level of Super-sizing french fries for their career! While those in India and other less developed countries lavish in the tech industries and manufacturing!
We will become a low pay *service* industry state!
Everyone will work for Starbucks and Burger King and will be able to tell you how they *feel* about everything!

Posted by: Deborah on May 15, 2005 09:47 PM
43. If you all think the WASL is bad, go figure what they teach in AP classes. My son recently finished AP US History. I drive around with him getting out of the house to have one-on-one father-son talks; asking him how things are going. I recently starting throwing some fact probing questions regarding US History and zeroed in on the Declaration of Independence, Bill of Rights, Dred Scott Decision, God in the Pledge of Allegiance, When Alaska and Hawaii became states, etc. He said and I qoute: "We don't need to get to that level of detail dad." I looked at him and said "What?". He said "We only need to know general facts." I asked him about the test. He said there was a question on the exam about the anti-war demostrations in the 1960s and the effect of those demonstrations on the war movement today. You can imagine the swill that was written about that question.

Pudster

Posted by: Puddybud on May 16, 2005 12:37 AM
44. Deborah,
I too would like to blame this test on the Clinton Administration, but blame lies entirely with Terry Bergeson. She started designing the test prior to her election as superintendent while she was president of the A+ Commission. She, personally, has too much invested in this test and this is why she won't let it go.
What came out of the Clinton Administration are the Goals 2000 legislation. That's another story!

Posted by: Shalimar on May 16, 2005 07:04 AM
45. Deborah,

I appreciate your candor, and intelligent explanation of this issue. I thought I might get a rise by saying I like the WASL, and I was right. While my comments were probably in error specifically regarding the WASL, they would have been more appropriately directed as indicative of the impetus created by the No Child Left Behind Act.

As you know, WASL, the state-mandated test, purports to measure proficiency in reading, writing, math and listening. The scores are used as the basis for measuring "Adequate Yearly Progress" (AYP) under the federal No Child Left Behind Act. No Child Left Behind was designed – at least outwardly – to force individual states to create tests and measure progress. It comes as no surprise that liberals are sabbotaging the process.

If they do not measure real progress as you say, it is almost certainly because of liberal involvement. HOWEVER – and here’s the rub – if the WASL is such a bad test, and the ITBS better, why is it that liberal’s pitch a world class bitch about WASL, and were silent about standards and testing before it came into effect. Further and more telling, why were so many students (that I had personal contact with in the early 2000’s) virtually illiterate after graduating from High School before the WASL? There are many conflicting (official and unofficial) reports about the WASL, and I don’t trust much of what is said. I read silly anecdotes and intemperate comments about the test from self appointed authorities that don’t ring true either, so what am I to believe?

I have instructed on the college level, tutored recent High School graduates in basic-basics, and assisted in training high school staff and students in peer mediation training as well as establishing a training program at a local High School. I was a poor High School student myself but I could read, write, spell, and I had a working knowledge of history and government. The many American High School students I worked with were self absorbed, pathetically illiterate, and brainwashed, while those from India, Pakistan, and central Europe are well prepared, disciplined, and far better trained. Without exception, the foreign stdents knew more about American History than American students. What can this mean?

SO LONG AS THERE IS AN NEA, AND A WEA, PLAY HELL EVER FIXING EDUCATION. I fully realize that the WASL is flawed, but my point is that testing is good, and liberals express hatred for anything that requires them to teach basics, establish standards or enforce them. Politically, there is no way that GW Bush could possibly tumble the NEA, and its hydra of state “education” union cadre. Short of this, anything that can be done to upset the strangle-hold that liberals have on our brain trust is fair game. If liberals are pi$$ed off, and in rabid opposition to something, it means that someone is doing something right. If teachers (predominantly liberals) are pi$$ed off, it means they are in some way being required to do their job, or prevented from misusing it. I don’t pretend this means they will actually do it right. The battle ensues and the casualties are our youth and our culture.

I still believe that communities need to take schools back from the NEA, and their state subsidiaries like the WEA and begin educating again rather than indoctrinating. At any rate I appreciate your levelheaded coherent rationale, and if the WASL is what you say it is, I stand corrected.

Posted by: Amused by liberals on May 16, 2005 09:48 AM
46. "HOWEVER – and here’s the rub – if the WASL is such a bad test, and the ITBS better, why is it that liberal’s pitch a world class bitch about WASL, and were silent about standards and testing before it came into effect. Further and more telling, why were so many students (that I had personal contact with in the early 2000’s) virtually illiterate after graduating from High School before the WASL?"

Amused,

You have to understand the history of the WASL and it's evolution from Clinton's time to Bush. The WASL was introduced at the same time many states introduced their version - during the Clinton term. The liberal's lauded it and couldn't wait to push it on our kids - even though 80% of the parents and teachers who previewed it were against it! (Make the kids appear to be suffering and call the Feds for more money!) When Bush came along with the No Child Left Behind Act - he forced the liberals to take their disasterous WASL test and use it as a tool to measure academic performance - BUT - if the state's kids are failing academically - the state will not get funding! The Feds will withold education funding and force the state to implement other means - like vouchers, ect...! Bush basically trumped the liberals in their own game! The liberal's aren't bitching at the test - they are bitching that they can no longer use it to gain federal funds!
The WASL was purposely put in place by the liberal Dems to make our kids appear to be failing and to give the impression that our state needed more federal funds for education.....It didn't work. Now the state is scrambling to change the WASL into something that can actually measure a childs ability. This is why we have seen a recent evolution of the test - and many concessions to the parents! Expect more changes! (expensive changes)

With the liberal Democrats - it's always about the money - and they will use and abuse our kids to get it! Always have and always will! So when they say something is *for the children*...be very afraid!

Posted by: Deborah on May 16, 2005 01:36 PM
47. Deborah,

Thanks again for the further clarification. My original comments were not far off at all. The WASL appears to be a lesson to liberals about deception, corruption and unintended consequences.

When Bush came along with the No Child Left Behind Act - he forced the liberals to take their disastrous WASL test and use it as a tool to measure academic performance. The WASL was purposely put in place by the liberal Dems to make our kids appear to be failing and to give the impression that our state needed more federal funds for education.....[BUT] It didn't work.

Now the state is scrambling to change the WASL into something that can actually measure a childs ability.

In terms of long run effect you are saying that my earlier comments about forcing schools to teach and test is essentially true. In the continuum there will come a time when the lazy a$$ liberal socialist WEA wonks must teach basics in lieu of liberal indoctrination, and teach students the basics.

I especially agree with you when you say:
With the liberal Democrats - it's always about the money - and they will use and abuse our kids to get it! Always have and always will! So when they say something is *for the children*...be very afraid!

The WASL may have been a liberal teacher’s friend once but it is no longer, and the enemy of my enemy is – in this case — my friend. Once again, and for those reasons, I think I like the WASL!

Thanks again.

Posted by: Amused by liberals on May 16, 2005 02:38 PM
48. Deborah,

Thanks again for the further clarification. My original comments were not far off at all. The WASL appears to be a lesson to liberals about deception, corruption and unintended consequences.

When Bush came along with the No Child Left Behind Act - he forced the liberals to take their disastrous WASL test and use it as a tool to measure academic performance. The WASL was purposely put in place by the liberal Dems to make our kids appear to be failing and to give the impression that our state needed more federal funds for education.....[BUT] It didn't work.

Now the state is scrambling to change the WASL into something that can actually measure a childs ability.

In terms of long run effect you are saying that my earlier comments about forcing schools to teach and test is essentially true. In the continuum there will come a time when the lazy a$$ liberal socialist WEA wonks must teach basics in lieu of liberal indoctrination, and teach students the basics.

I especially agree with you when you say:
With the liberal Democrats - it's always about the money - and they will use and abuse our kids to get it! Always have and always will! So when they say something is *for the children*...be very afraid!

The WASL may have been a liberal teacher’s friend once but it is no longer, and the enemy of my enemy is – in this case — my friend. Once again, and for those reasons, I think I like the WASL!

Thanks again.

Posted by: Amused by liberals on May 16, 2005 02:46 PM
49. Deborah is right on.

The administration is and has always been able to manipulate the WASL to increase federal funding. Bush called their bluff and made the educators accountable for their own test and now the flaws are being exposed and the liberals are running scared. The only thing they know how to do is slam Bush; it's his fault.

Professionals that have examined the WASL liken it more to an IQ test. Less than 1/2 of 1% of the essential learnings focus on computation in the math portions of the test.

The WASL is not consistent, and its grading is very subjective. It has been reported in studies on the WASL that the same WASL test will come back with 5 different grades if graded by 5 different graders. In a Renton school they went from 11% passing to an 81% passing in just 2 years. One would think the ITBS and SAT would jump equally as fast in this school, but they didn't. This is why the ITBS had to go; it was exposing the truth of this test.

The WASL is shrouded in secrecy. The student, his/her parents and the teacher are never allowed to see the results of the WASL, nor are they told what portions the child was weak in or failed (other than a generic-failed one of the 3 portions) The student and the teacher has no way to learn from the WASL results to improve their teaching and/or learning.

Because the WASL is mostly a reading/writing test a student can get an answer wrong, but still be graded positively.

For example: 2+2=
Explain your answer

The student can answer 5, which is clearly a wrong answer but if he/she explains their answer in the narrative in a way they like, he'll receive a passing score for that question.

I can go on all day about this test. Unfortunately, this has become a partisan issue which divides us even more; all at the expense of our children and the future of this state.
This test is more than dangerous and parents and the community better wise up before it's too late.

Posted by: Shalimar on May 16, 2005 04:16 PM
50. Shalimar,

We had better wise up to a lot more about education than just the WASL. So long as the NEA, and WEA exist and have influence over education, tests are small potatoes.
Nevertheless, points well taken.

Posted by: Amused by liberals on May 16, 2005 06:59 PM
51. I agree but the public can only handle this is in small sound bites. The WASL is the only thing they can wrap their brains around. If you tell them the driving force behind the WEA and the NEA they'll think we're a bunch of kooks.

Here's a sample of what I'm talking about...

Who wrote the following?

"Although they (children) appear to behave appropriately and seem normal by most cultural standards, they may actually be in need of mental health care in order to help them change, adapt, and conform to the planned society where there will be no conflict of attitudes or beliefs".

That passage can be found in the National Education Association, National Training Laboratory Manual, p. 47

The WASL is the mechanism being used to assess the kids progress for the above planned thinking so the educators can develope their planned society.

I'll let you place the appropiate label on what is happening in education.

Posted by: Shalimar on May 17, 2005 07:49 AM
52. Shalimar: How do you get a copy of the National Education Association's National Training Laboratory Manual? What other current publications have they produced that outline their policies and goals? Not that I need any more reading material, but I do like a good horror story now and then...

Posted by: PeggyU on May 17, 2005 09:37 AM
53. I probably agree with your actual positions and opinions about education more than you know. It has been my belief since the late 1960's that education is the seed plant for the liberal democrat, socialist communist take over of the hearts and minds of America.

I confirmed this once again upon attending a local college to obtain a sciences degree. Because of my age I was often treated as a professor, by both students and other professors. I observed the indoctrination up close and personal, and was academically victimized by some of its effects because I am conservative.

There is a group of young students that are much more conservative who are demanding answers and things are slowly changing. Many of the young students see right through the flapdoodle pseudo-educational hype that is presented and they simply don't participate. Professors are encouraging those weaker of the student body to revolt.

While my battles against liberalism are on a different front, education is really the nerve center of their strangle hold on our society. I appreciate your interest in this subject. Maybe you should write something comprehensive and present it to Shark or one of the SP contributors for publication. I would read and support it with interest.

Thanks for your comments.

Posted by: Amused by liberals on May 17, 2005 09:45 AM
54. Peggy-there's a lot of information out there on this. There is a book by Charlotte ???(Iserbe??) about the dumbing down and another book by John Gotto, a retired school teacher. I'll get you the names and email them later.

One very interesting manual I came across a couple of years ago is called "No Right Turn". It was written for the WEA. It is a 200 page manual teaching educators how to keep the conservatives out of education. Unbelievable!
They will stop at nothing to implement their plan for the future.

Amused-yes we do think the same about this issue. Sorry to attack you when I thought you LOVED the WASL. It is Communism, but if you use those words, even the right gets scared. I saw Shark on Saturday at a ladies republican meeting and I brought up what is going on in the schools and his response was, it won't happen to his kid because he has a handle on education. He thinks it's just a question of good curriculum vs. bad curriculum. Shark is VERY naive about education; his kid is only 3 years old. We'll fix that!

I am very frustrated with parents-most won't do a thing to change this. I blame parents for allowing this to happen. I'm in the Lake Washington School District-considered one of the best in the state. I have brought the fuzzy math, WASL and anti-parent curriculum to their attention. They don't blink an eye. I am applying to private schools right now for my kids-I have no other choice. They get once chance in life at a good education and I owe it to them to provide that.

Bergeson is now implementing the Culminating Project which is required for graduation. January 2005 they held a training seminar for teachers on how to advise the kids how to do this project. At the seminar they unveiled their new requirments for the project. The students will have to select a topic from one of three subjcts; Diversity, Social Justice or Environment. (you can download the manuals from OSPI website) Part of their required project will be to particiapate in some sort of community service and/or activism. WTO comes to my mind. Part of this curriculum is being written by a guy name Adam Fletcher. Check out his site at www.freechild.org
No matter where you look, it gets stranger and stranger. This plan of theirs is so deep and entrenched in education I don't think anyone in public schools can escape.

Posted by: shalimar on May 17, 2005 11:35 AM
55. Shalimar,

I appreciate anything that acts as a lever against liberal insanity.
No matter where you look, it gets stranger and stranger. This plan of theirs is so deep and entrenched in education I don't think anyone in public schools can escape.
Chilling but true, I believe it will take nothing short of a revolution to arrive at any sort of resolution. What do you think about charter schools and the like? I realize that it sounds over simplistic, but why not form one in your community?

Posted by: Amused by liberals on May 18, 2005 09:23 AM
56. Charter schools are a great idea but the way the ed-reform law was written, schools must still use the WASL which means they must teach to the WASL which means they're not truly independent.
I don't think the revolution will ever come. Most parents who see what's happening are homeschooling or sending the kids to private. That's what we're doing next year; off to private they go. The rest think everything is just fine.
Last year we discovered Bergesons new program called Links Learning on the OSPI site...it's still there. Come to find out it leads kids directly to hard-core porn. Incredibly hard-core stuff. (The porn is now gone)
Anyway, we went to the channel 7 investigative reporter; Chris Halsny (sp?). We told him all about the what's going on in education today and thought he would understand since he has kids. His response was, the reason people move to Seattle is for the touchy-feely new-age education we have...parents want that. What a shock!!
I really do think Savage is right...Liberalism is a mental disorder.

Posted by: Shalimar on May 18, 2005 02:19 PM
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