The State Parks and Recreation Commission is trying to persuade more African-Americans to go camping in the state parks. There doesn't seem to be any evidence of discrimination against black people. It's just that the data shows that people of some ethnic groups choose to go camping more than others, so some in the government feel inspired to change people's preferences.
Now if they can only convince more of my fellow Jews to go hunting and attend NASCAR races...
Posted by Stefan Sharkansky at July 06, 2005 09:51 AM | Email ThisIt's a waste of time. A solution looking for a problem. I do not watch pro basketball nor follow rap stars. Wil anyone grab me and ask why not? Will I be given free tickets or cd's? Everyone skirts the simple answer--maybe some people simply do not like the outdoors, bugs or whatever. I know people who would never take a cruise. Others would never go outside their hotel doors. What's the worry?
Choices, people--CHOICES! I buy modest sneakers. I CHOOSE not to buy MJ-endorsed $140 shoes from Nike. They--like the parks--are available to all. Some of us CHOOSE them, some do not. And that's where the argument should stop.
This is a typical bureaucrat's idea. Put this silly item on one's "2005 career development goals" for one's upcoming job eval and pursue it. Don't do anything of SUBSTANCE. What next--national park signs in Ebonics or rap language?
Posted by: Jimmie-howya-doin on July 6, 2005 10:05 AMThen again you could just be sensible and allow everyone decide what they like to do with their free time.
Posted by: fred on July 6, 2005 10:17 AMI think it's hopeless for Goldstein re: hunting. He seems to believe squirrels, rabbits and deer all have feelings and the same rights as tax-paying humans. Once again, I think if I showed Goldstein even a PICTURE of my gun collection, he would pass out much less let him touch a gun.
I have a number of Jewish friends who are certainly not like that LEFTIST PINHEAD Goldstein...that would love to have a NASCAR track to go watch the big boys (and girls).
These folks don't need or want a government subsidized program to encourage them though Stefan.
Also, my black friends HATE camping. They prefer to stay in 5-star resorts in Maui!
Posted by: Mr. Cynical on July 6, 2005 10:32 AMJim
Posted by: Jim L on July 6, 2005 10:48 AMA few weeks ago on the history channel was a great program about the developement across siberia by the bolsheviks under Stalin -- the locations for "towns" and "cities" were picked and people forcibly settled there and over time these places have largely become ghost towns since there was no real naturally occuring reason for them to be there in the first place (This is prior to the relocation of tank and airplane factories at the begining of WW2) - the program contrasted that developement with the American West where the settlements grew naturally and were generally located at logical places which fit the production and transportation modes and needs of the times -- something Stalin tried to emulate but largely failed since it did not occur in a logical progression but as a "PLANNED" developement -- modern day incarnation would be unkle Sim's and his planned community at the stadiums -- by god we will make these people crowd together at the monorail station whether would ever do so naturally or not --
As well as the other crappy ideas for mass transit that do not serve the actual commuting needs of the people that are forced to pay for them -- many times we hear - who wants to go from west seattle to ballard? -- well there were plenty of reason for both to go to downtown or stadiums -- the real question is - who wants/needs to go from the airport to UW - that whole concept Should have been a very RED flag -- bottom line who uses public transit to get back and forth to the airport -- certainly very few people with luggage - that leaves the Harry Kirishnas -- they could commute back and forth between the airport, UW HUB and U district Post Office - WHAT A DEAL!!!!! probably get a special deal on the tickets too since it is for 'religous' purposes.
Posted by: Bill on July 6, 2005 11:00 AMWhen I was in high school, along with some friends, I started downhill skiing. Grandma's eyebrows raised, but she said nothing. When she heard the lift ticket prices, she muttered, "Uff!" under her breath.
During college, a few friends took up cross-country skiing. I expressed an interest, and my Grandmother responded, "Now what in the hell would you want spend money to do that for?"
I told her it was the latest thing, all my friends were doing it, and I bet that she would like skiing if she had tried it when she was younger.
"Tried skiing? You think I haven't tried skiing? Little girl, you have a lot to learn. How do you think I got to school, to church, and then to work during the winter while I was growing up?"
"Six months a year I was 'cross-country skiing' as you kids say, six miles to town and six miles back, every day but Saturday for fourteen years. You go cross country ski twelve miles a day, six days a week for the long Norwegian winters of fourteen years, and come back and tell me how much you like it."
"As for me, I'll keep my car."
Recreation is all about perspective. If some folks don't find sleeping in the rain and the bugs as appealing as others, or driving around the country in recreational vehicles the size of a shipping container, why bother to waste tax dollars trying to change their mind? As with my Grandmother, they may have a darned good reason they don't find certain types of recreation all that enjoyable.
Posted by: Susan B. Anthony on July 6, 2005 11:56 AMYou should make this a regular feature of your blog. Identify wasteful programs and start to tally the price of all this. (Maybe a cash register on the side of the blog.)
While collecting signatures for I-912, the "nay" folks usually asked where the money from roads will come from. I started to mention a couple dumb programs, but it would be good to have a "go to" tally board for this.
And the collective mind of the blogosphere should be able to help scour through the state budget for bad programs.
Posted by: John Lemon on July 6, 2005 11:58 AMYou will be required to participate 4 times a year at you own expense in your assigned recreational activity.
You may not participate in recreational activities to which you are not assigned.
You may not trade assignments with other as this would upset the balance achieved by assigning activities.
Those already living will be assigned an activity. Please turn all related equipment in to Recreation Central.
You will purchase equipment at Recreation Central for your assigned activity.
Now go out and enjoy your recreational activity.
That is all.
Big Brother Out.
The key question is: Are they acting like a private company seeking to expand their customer base? Or are they acting like a PC bureaucracy seeking "racial balance"? Is it an investment in future earnings, or government control?
Posted by: Shannon K on July 6, 2005 12:51 PMMaybe this has to do with the number of single mother black families. when I was growing up it was my FATHER who took me camping. I didn't know anyone white or black whose mother took them camping.
Maybe to solve this problem they need figure out how to decrease the number of single black female parent families.
Of course I realize the above is a generalization and stereotype as the PNW is the nations leader in single mother families of all races.
Posted by: david on July 6, 2005 12:53 PMSay--Since Ron Sims loves homeless tent cities, can we get him to be a spokseman for minority camping? Can you see him in a pair of kakhi shorts, neck bandanna, pith helmet, big teethy sneaky politico vote-getting smile and roasting a marshmallow by the fire as the camera pans in for his pep talk to go camping? Tell me this guy would not like the TV time!!
Posted by: Jimmie-howya-doin on July 6, 2005 12:53 PMShannon, you definitely have a good question. I'm sure it is a little of both, especially now that they charge at quite a number of hiking trails and for just getting entrance into parks via road.
Posted by: Editor on July 6, 2005 01:00 PMSome people like them. Some people hate them. Who cares? Personal choice. No one is forced to get one. Therefore, no need to "study this phenomenon." Like gravity, it just "is."
However, like a tattoo, this issue will stay for a long time in the government's "client enhancement goals" program book. Watch for its reincarnation in a few years. Like the 17-year cicadias that emerge, for all of you midwestern folk who know what I mean.
Posted by: Jimmie-howya-doin on July 6, 2005 02:45 PMWe need to increase the amount of minority rangers. We need to improve security and safety in the parks. We need to retrain those little towns between the city and the parks and make them more friendly.
How about reducing the camping fees? Giving gasoline vouchers for the travel expense?
I agree with the others, this is a choice. I know a lot of non minorities that don't go camping. I don't know why and I don't care, their choice.
The PC crowd spends too much time and public resources trying to achieve equal outcome, rather than equal opportunity. All Americans have ever wanted is equal opportunity. What they do with those opportunities is their choice.
Posted by: SouthernRoots on July 6, 2005 03:11 PMAnd although I don't think it is at all the way to hire people, you can't say that trying to hire based on skin color or ancestry is anything new -- more of the same.
Posted by: Sarah of WA on July 6, 2005 03:37 PMSo that means the PC crowd needs to spend our tax dollars to create warmer snow and that all swim meets should be held in salt water so the blacks are able to float better.
Also 99% of blacks do not listen to "hard rock" music. What is the PC crowds solution to this?
Posted by: PC or Die on July 6, 2005 04:28 PMThe dream begins with non-anglo, 'rainbow' children pouring out of their row houses built on a former stadium parking lot, then boarding a swift monorail crossing the lake where a neglected bridge had sunken, rapidly exiting on the Eastern shore of the lake before a meadering trail that had earlier been a front yard (and before that a train track), and entering a camp ground for the masses made from ordinary garden variety blue tarp carefully recycled from donations made by a few 'good' anglos. Of course the property used for this outdoor education was granted by Uncle Ron's constitutionally provided excercising of eminent domain when that RB software tycoon wouldn't sell! Once inside the camp, the rainbow children listen intently to stories told by their pink and purple (triangle) clad hosts......
(Fade to white....thank goodness this was only a bad dream or was it?)
I worked in Africa for six years doing medical work. I can't imagine one of the many Sudanese or Ugandan immigrants who are now in my area of the U.S. going "camping". They'd think they were being forced back into refugee camps and that any of us who suggested it or took them were either NUTS or quite insensitive to their recent past.
Posted by: Jim M on July 6, 2005 08:28 PMEditor,
Re: "V" Monologues. I am speechless.
alphabet soup,
Happy Brithday to our adorable President George W. Bush!
Next they'll be forcing public marinas to have quotas for slips for minorities...gee, why all these white AND males with the boats.
stupid!
(great quip shark; reminds me of the jokes my jewish friends would say about the shortest list in the world, list of jewish fishermen or jewish day laborers..)
Posted by: righton on July 6, 2005 08:57 PMDETROIT -- A federal appeals court today reinstated a so-called "bicycling-while-black" lawsuit after finding that there is enough evidence of racial discrimination and illegal searches by a suburban Detroit police department to take the case to a jury. The American Civil Liberties Union of Michigan argued the appeal of the racial profiling lawsuit...
I think there really is quite a bit less usage of state and national parks by minorities, and especially African Americans. The anecdotal observations by park rangers that they hardly ever see any blacks are no doubt correct. The opinions expressed in the black focus groups are certainly genuinely felt.
True enough, there is no discrimination against black people in this area. Washington has never had state laws mandating segregations (unlike some southern states just a few decades ago) and was one of the first states to outlaw racial discrimination by businesses (back when many states were still requiring discrimination). And there are probably very, very few people in the small towns up here any more that have hard core racist attitudes.
I think the state program is fairly reasonable, especially in its efforts to get private donations. And it certainly would be better for big businesses to donate money to encourage minorities to visit our state park system, than it would be to donate money to Keep Rolling Washington.
A lot of government so-called "diversity" programs go way too far. Especially in our universities and even in our public schools. I don't think the park promotion program fits into that category.
Posted by: Richard Pope on July 6, 2005 09:23 PMIf these government officials are so concerned about this "problem," why not do some surveys or other research and find out whether the "problem" really is discrimination or something related or something that they never even considered?
The idea that these officials just *know* why few black people camp is arrogant presumption, something that black people are familiar with when it comes to those who think they know what "all" black people think.
I think it's presumptuous to think that just because I enjoy something that something must be wrong if another does not enjoy that same thing.
Disclaimer: I am black and I enjoy camping, so don't go by me.
Posted by: Juliette on July 7, 2005 12:22 AMI am loosing sleep over this.
Posted by: BananaLand(aka Iguana) on July 7, 2005 12:33 AMI also have taken note through the years that black swimmers seem to be under-represented at both public and private swimming pools. I have always wondered when the military Special Operations Command would establish a program reaching out to minorities encouraging them to learn to swim so that they are not under-represented in US Army Special Forces and US Navy SEALS (the swim test seems to be a common failure point for most blacks wanting to enlist in these types of units).
We need a Congressional Blue Ribbon Commission to investigate.
Posted by: Rascal on July 7, 2005 05:43 AMOh, that's right the repressed minorities can't afford to go camping. So the solution is we need a government subsidy for the repressed masses to buy camping gear (hold the phone while I buy REI Stock). To fund this program we'll tax, oh, camping gear.
Richard, how about we let folks choose their own recreation and just leave government out of it.
I know that is a foreign concept to you, it's called:
FREEDOM!!!!!!!
Rant off//
Posted by: JCM on July 7, 2005 07:19 AMUsing the above (and your) park usage logic and "problem-to-solve" reasoning, should we now restrict the Asians' uses of trails to "balance out the diversity profile" of the local community? We can admit park users based on very specific Census Bureau stats on the park's community. There--that's "fair" and "diverse."
Our parks and trails are dying from overuse (i.e. popularity) and need care, not silly analyses as to what color foot stomped the native vegetation.
As for training those of us that live in small towns near the parks to be more friendly, well being more polite when your in my town might help.
That's the biggest complaint I've heard from the small town folks.
Parks has tried the diversity thing at least a couple other times in the past. they've tried to hire more black rangers too, but if they don't apply what are you supposed to do ?
Posted by: catnik on July 7, 2005 02:42 PMLike anything in life, don't let a few determine your overall views. Most of us visit, are grateful for the sights and LOVE to spend local money at your places to boost the local economy.
To me, it's basic respect. I treat those places like my friend's home & back yard. No litter. No jackass behaving. No trespassing. Asking permission first. Simple. Forget the diversity usage studies. Act like a civilized human, get treated like same. Act otherwise, and the hammer drops on your head.
Posted by: Jimmie-howya-doin on July 7, 2005 09:40 PMPersonally, I have not seen many minority campers over the years, but I thought it not a problem. I assumed that with all the camping/outdoor options available to nearly everyone (parks, YMCA, church groups, financial assistance, boy/girl scouts) interested parties would have chosen to try things by now.
Do you go fishing? Hunting? If not, why not? Perhaps it's a matter of simple preferences. Like food. Like the use of liquor. Like TV programs or movies. Is it important why? What matters is that you are enjoying it while you can and while you are healthy and happy! That's the right answer to me!
Here's another hint: when folks tell you the truth, believe them.
Posted by: Juliette on July 10, 2005 10:31 PM