April 23, 2007
ST2/RTID Deathwatch

The Washington Policy Center has released a new Policy Brief on the ST2/RTID ballot measure, which estimates that the measure will cost the average Puget Sound household $268 a year, a 24% increase in total transportation taxes.

And the punchline of the ST2/RTID joke is that even after spending all this money, most everybody's commutes will only get worse.

Sound Transit's push-poll aside, ST2/RTID smells like political death. Postman reports that Mrs. Gregoire, Speaker Chopp and Senate Majority Leader Brown plan to campaign for some ballot measures this fall:

But none said they planned to campaign for the regional transportation package that will also appear on the ballot.
Tick tock.

Posted by Stefan Sharkansky at April 23, 2007 04:32 PM | Email This
Comments
1. Just vote noooooooo on any tax increases in August & November of any kind. Three years now, nothing has been done to fix the problems with our roads. The only thing that has been done is more reckless spending.

Posted by: George on April 23, 2007 04:54 PM
2. How about a state wide vote based on one simple voter choice, Road or Rail?

The ballot would be set up like this:

55% of the State transportation budget (what-ever it happens to be) would be mandated spending evenly split between roads and alternative transport (rail,light rail. bikes, ferries, whatever)

The remaining 45% would be voter directed. Simply choose on the ballot where you would like the state to spend the remaining 45% .

When election results are tablulated the unmandated portion of the budget would be allocated in accordance with the voting percentages associated with the road or rail vote.

The result would truly reflect the will of the people in directing the tax dollars collected from them. It will never happen, but the thought of allowing the people to decide would offer peace of mind to voters regardless of the outcome.

Posted by: cardio on April 23, 2007 05:06 PM
3. It seems like the appropriate action would be to list projects, prioritize, and then ask for enough money to fund the most important projects. Instead we get a lot of money thrown at a lot of projects. Nothing gets finished and "they" wonder why the support isn't there. Sometimes I feel like I'm living in a Lewis Carroll novel.

Posted by: touchstone on April 23, 2007 05:07 PM
4. And the punchline of the ST2/RTID joke is that even after spending all this money, most everybody's commutes will only get worse.

That's as inane as saying that the punchline of all the medical care I've had throughout my life is that my health has only got worse. Without medical care I would be even worse. The question is how would traffic differ with/without the transportation package.

Silly comments like this detract from any leigitimate beefs you may have with the package.

Posted by: Bruce on April 23, 2007 05:19 PM
5. $268.00, is of course a joke. It was based on the average vehicle value in the three county region of $8,500.00. They also made the assumption that there was only ONE car per family, now look in your drive way and double or triple that $268.00 number. Don't worry, it gets alot better, "Transit Now" cannot identify anywhere near the promised increases in bus service pimped during the recent election for the increased .01 of 1 % . It is just the latest in a long line over hyping and under performing by transit authorities at the State, County and City levels.

Reject the RTID/ST2 until we can elect someone who is serious about moving people, goods and services via our highways. When and until everyone in Government starts PAYING to ride mass transit and it is made a condition of employment (including management)it's all just a game to force the "little people" into a utopian vision quest of compliance.

Posted by: Smokie on April 23, 2007 06:53 PM
6. Bruce-

I'm assuming that the medical care you've received has been for mental health issues - I'd hate to have read one of your posts before your "medical care".

Fact is, the last gas tax hike was supposed to take care urgent "they're going to collapse and hundreds will die" viaduct and 520 bridge. We're still years away. I have no faith/trust in the liberal Ds running this insane asylum called Washington.

Posted by: Jeffro on April 23, 2007 07:03 PM
7. Smokie-

Great handle by the way.

You are 100% correct. I'm a sarcastic A$$ so my posts are admittedly, more sarcasm than substance.

I am one of the little people - but the libs will have to pry my cold dead fingers off my stearing wheel to get me out of my car.

Posted by: Jeffro on April 23, 2007 07:09 PM
8. Until the politicians come up with a Transportation package that significantly reduces the amount for Light Rail - I'll vote No, no - a thousand times NO !

Posted by: KS on April 23, 2007 07:42 PM
9. All of you out there who think light rail is the answer to congestion, take a look at Portland. They are the poster child for light rail. Their lines hae been up and running for several years and traffic is just as bad or worse than the Seattle area. So if light rail is the answer, why isn't Portland a nirvana for commuters? Well, because it only works for about 5% of the population, can't come anywhere close to carrying enough people to make any measurable difference in traffic volume and most people have to drive a car to a parking lot to catch the train. And worst of all, it cost a "friggin" fortune to build!

Posted by: RJK on April 23, 2007 08:42 PM
10. I and my whole family will be voting NO NO and Hell NO on any and all of these idiots tax hikes. They have spent the 2 billion surplus on raises for themselves, travel all over the world, and limo's to take them everywhere.

I vote to keep some of what I earn with my family!

That's the emergency I care about!

Posted by: GS on April 23, 2007 09:43 PM
11. This is entertaining. People, given an opportunity would vote down Sound Transit and they know it. And the reasons for drowning the Sound are obvious.

So in order to get money for Sound Transit the crafted little devils in Olympia coupled it to roads. Want more roads then you must pay for Sound Transit. All or nothing so they say.

This type of thinking proves to all that we are consider at best suckers at worst - use your own imaginations. Remember you are dealing with politicians that are capable of anything. And done most anything in one session. They will lie, cheat and steal to suit their purposes.

A cursory review of the important emergencies that they responded to last session would reveal the vile and cunning of your elected leaders.

Just about every group friendly to the Democrats have benefited at our expense last session. Imagine that!

Let's see the last vote for transportation included such promises for our consideration as the Viaduct - it was about to crumble. Are they held accountable for their inactions on this emergency? Nope, not a one.

We pay an extraordinarily high tax in this state and get very little in return. What we do get, we don't want:

1. Costly schools producing students that can't pass state exams.

2. Roads and bridges that are unsafe.

3. Catch and release for criminals.

4. A court system unable to mete out timely justice.

5. A minimum wage that result in waiters making $20 dollars an hour. Chech you tab lately.

6. A mandated union for government employees and teachers.

7. Property taxes on property you can't use or sell. It is for the enviroment.

8. Sound transit where costs are the benefits.

9. Unfriendly business climate.

10. My all time favorite - No investigation on the election. None. And her ill-begotten highness is paying back all of her supporters with your tax dollars. $3o billion is real money folks. Your money. And it is only the beginning. Democrats are an expensive lot. And the cost of buying votes keeps increasing.

Posted by: Snuffy on April 23, 2007 09:48 PM
12. IMHO, the traffic is bad in Portland, even on Saturdays. Between the I-405 and the light rail system it sure has made my getting around downtown difficult. I can't turn left on Burnside to go up Vista Ave therefore I have to weave my way around to get up to Vista Ave and I can no longer travel on some of the streets that I would have traveled in the past before light rail, etc.

There is hardly a week that goes by that there isn't a mugging at one of the light rail stations including downtown Portland. Is that the type of place that you would want your Mother, or your Sister or how about your 16 year old daughter? I do see the trains all the time, however there is not very many riders. Mostly empty seats.

Posted by: Janet on April 23, 2007 09:51 PM
13. Like many Left leaning causes, rail is dying, and the memo has not reached those folks yet. And this is especially true in the Puget Sound. There will never be any comprehensive rail system in this region. There's just too much water. Everyone reading this will be long dead before the first train reaches Gig Harbor, and that's the most possible route where there's a new bridge.

To top this off, the automobile is on the rise. Lots of folks like to moan about gas prices, but the auto is far cheaper to own and operate than ever before. And over time, it will only become more so. As new technologies replace fossil fuels, and as manufacturing gets better and better, auto costs will continue to drop, in the same way that many other mass produced items are cheaper than ever. A cheap ULEV is far less to own and operate than any regional transit fare, and that's with the MASSIVE subsidies that make the transit system look affordable. A Toyota Yaris gets 40 MPG HWY at just over $11,000 price tag. There's simply no way for transit to compete with the flexibility, greenness, and longevity of these new "disposable" cars. Even if you don't factor in the MASSIVE capital and expense subsidies used to keep Sound Transit alive, there's something far more fair about each person bearing the cost of vehicle maintenance than having a yard full of union wage train mechanics. And I bet the Sounder Trains don't have a multi year warranty like the Yaris either.

And we live in a world of increasing violence. With felon release programs, shooting rampages and constant threat of more gun control, the average Joe will become increasingly dubious of public transit. My brother was mugged at the Rose Garden station of the Portland MAX light rail, and that was about ten years ago. How many people are going to be riding the light rail at night, lugging their bags, through Ranier Valley, to "near" the airport so they can then get on a shuttle to the airport? Crickets chirping.

Most folks wake up every morning and make an economic decision. And for the vast majority, it is far faster and cheaper to drive a car. Will trains be coming soon to the many massive suburban developments? And will those trains connect to the many disparate corporate business parks? NO and NO.

Rail is dead. Money would be far better spent on buses and roads. But the left will continue to dump money into train fantasies.

The left should have the motto: Billions spent, hundreds served.

Posted by: Jeff B. on April 23, 2007 10:38 PM
14. Jeffro@6 imagines: Fact is, the last gas tax hike was supposed to take care urgent "they're going to collapse and hundreds will die" viaduct and 520 bridge.

Fact is, no. The bill clearly stated that it only partially funded those projects.

See: http://www.wsdot.wa.gov/accountability/2005GasTax/

Posted by: Bruce on April 24, 2007 12:16 AM
15. Bruce-

Um, has anything -ANYTHING- been done about the viaduct. As far as I know, it's been about to collapse since they used it to push through the tax. Oh yeah, they've paid millions to take core samples to determine if it stands on any Native American sacred land.

These folks are full of hogwash and you can't deny it.

Posted by: Jeffro on April 24, 2007 05:59 AM
16. COST OF LIVING and TAX BURDEN are clearly huge issues for R's in the 2008 Washington Elections.

They need to put together the definitive TAX BURDEN summary that includes BOTH what we are already paying AND what the KLOWNS at various levels have proposed.

The R's must take Tax information like this and clearly combine it with all other taxes in a clear, concise summary.

People of all walks have had it.
The problem is the lack of a clear, concise summary of Dem impact on our pocketbooks.

Posted by: Mr. Cynical on April 24, 2007 06:06 AM
17. In addition to Mr. C @ 16, Punctuate every point with a video clip of Gregoire saying she won't raise taxes,

To anyone who knows:

Wasn't the prior state budget 22 billion? How did we end up with a 33 billion budget just two years later. Maybe I'm unaware of this huge cost of living increase. I just don't remember getting more than a 3% cost of living increase during that time. Seriously, why should government budgets grow greater than the cost of living?

Posted by: Jeffro on April 24, 2007 06:50 AM
18. Jeffro, it is my understanding that after the failure on the last election, the State is going to do a minimum retrofit and add a couple of on/off ramps. This retrofit should last a while.

$268/year? Not too bad when I almost had to pay $240/year for a library expansion I don't use and is 10 miles away.

Posted by: swatter on April 24, 2007 06:55 AM
19. An RTID vote that doesn't fully fund a new 520 bridge is a complete waste of time. But the fact that rails are being forced on us with this bill will ensure NO votes out of our household.

Posted by: Palouse on April 24, 2007 07:51 AM
20. I attended a meeting at ST headquarters and mid-afternoon a receptionist came into the room and ask - "who needs their parking validated?" There were about 50 people in attendance, including ST's Citizen Oversite Board and ST Board members as well as elected and appointed officials from practically every jurisdiction in the Puget Sound region. Take a guess how many hands went up? Remember this was an all-day meeting taking place at the single most served location in the entire region. I will let you know the answer this afternoon.

Posted by: surroundedByFailure on April 24, 2007 08:03 AM
21. surrounded,

Nice catch. When you get the number of hands went up, Stefan should make that a new post, or maybe you could guest post. It's important that people realize that no one, even the transit high priests, uses what is an unworkable and expensive system.

Posted by: Jeff B. on April 24, 2007 09:12 AM
22. I'll bite, SBF. ALL of 'em?

Posted by: 4woodenboats on April 24, 2007 09:41 AM
23. I paid particularly close attention to the count and there was a TOTAL of twelve (12) individuals attending, one of whom was your's truely, who did not need to have their parking validated. That leaves about 38 that drove alone to the meeting. There were a half dozen ST staff members present, they were not included in my count. The Transportation reporter from the Times and I had an interesting conversation regarding the transparent hypocrisy represented at this meeting. "Good enough for yee, but not for me" seems to be the motto over at ST.

Posted by: surroundedByFailure on April 24, 2007 12:20 PM
24. This vote is six months away and it already is starting to rot. The final price tag hasn't even been revealed.

Who knows . . . maybe we have wised up some. Voters shot down monorail (eventually), and neither of the pricey viaduct replacement options got a majority of "yes" votes. Sounds kinda funny to say it, but that is a positive "negative" trend.

Hopefully that rejection-momentum will carry through to November so we can bury this abomination.

Posted by: Orotund on April 24, 2007 01:44 PM
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