August 23, 2007
Arab and Muslim "groups" resent anti-terrorism investigation
Today's NPR All Things Considered interviews Seattle Times reporter Mike Carter about the suspicious ferry riders sought by the FBI.
Also today, the Times reports that "Muslim- and Arab-American leaders are upset that the FBI didn't consult them" before publishing the photographs of the ferry-riders:
We need to get some type of apology from them and figure out how to get back to where we were," said Rita Zawaideh, head of the Arab-American Community Coalition.
Huh?
It's Ms. Zawaideh who owes the FBI an apology for wasting their time and distracting them from doing their jobs. Since when do law enforcement professionals need permission from self-appointed ethnic outrage pimps to conduct an investigation? Besides, we don't even know whether the men in the photograph are, say, Arab, Muslim, Indian or Mizrahi Jewish. Why should the Muslim- and Arab-American "groups" be acting so defensively?
If anybody here is engaged in ethnic profiling and stereotyping, it's not the FBI.
Posted by Stefan Sharkansky at August 23, 2007
06:18 PM | Email This
1. It never ceases to amaze me how far people will go to "protect civil liberties." Heaven forbid the FBI actually stops an attack. And if they don't then all the fingers get pointed at the FBI.
Next time the P I runs a partial plate when a crime is committed and the partial is the same sequence as the numbers and first letter on my parents car. I'm gonna make sure they sue the P I for invasion of their privacy.
2. "Muslim- and Arab-American leaders are upset that the FBI didn't consult them" before publishing the photographs of the ferry-ride
Good reason to halt immigration, clean up the citizens that have a problem the way this country handles threats before us. If you don't like this country, then leave and take the illegal's with you.
3. How long before the crews, then the police are told to "lay off" a certain politically correct group?
Or maybe it's already happening.
Could that be why the Mexican gangs go nearly un touched?
The left continues to be the criminal's best friend.
4. Figure out how to get back to where we were?
Does she mean the 7th century or just to the point where they were burning effigies of our president?
5. That "consult" line made me literally laugh out loud.
6. What makes the Arab-American Community Coalition so edgy at two unidentified photographs?
I was betting those were Greeks, and some other guys in the bar said Turks, and one Welshman said they looked like his cousins, and then a Spaniard demanded equal time... it was a mess.
The self-righteous protests are more divisive than the photos.
7. Screw the Muzzies. Not one of them has stepped forward to publivly denounce Islamic terrorism. What's that tell you about the 'religion of peace(tm)?
8. yeah consult... What? did they want some time to airbrush the photos to a lighter shade???
9. KIRO Big Story at 6 ran the same story. What amazed me was they made no attempt to balance the view that the FBI is supposed to clear all their business through the Muslim community. Was there no one who was willing to go on air and say that what the Muslims wanted was total BS? Or at least ask the Muslim self-appointed leader what he would have done, if he had been given 45 minutes heads up?
It speaks volumes that these guys remain unidentified. If the Muslim community wanted to promote goodwill, they would be vetting their mosques. CAIR and the rest speak a good game, but are nothing but jihadis. Where was the reliable apologist and publicity hound Jeph Saddiqi?
10. Too damn bad!
I resent them too! And any other criminal!
Keep your F&@#ing followers on a leash!
And screw them we don't need permission when there is a ? of doubt!
Don't get me angry or I'll have to whoop you with a good slash!
11. Can someone point me to where it says law enforcement must get CAIR's and similar groups' blessing before publishing photos of men wanted for questioning?
12. If it were two blond, blue-eyed guys who were seen doing the exact same thing, no one would be saying a peep (never mind that I don't have blond hair and blue eyes; but apparently if someone shows a photo of someone who shares your same race, you're supposed to get all offended??). And why would anyone, anyway? We would all be glad to know who to watch out for.
What these racial interest groups are forgetting is that the photos aren't important because they feature arab-looking men, it's because they feature arab-looking men who were seen acting a lot like potential terrorists would. (oh come on---regular tourists don't do all the stuff they were observed doing. But what they were doing DOES sound like what terrorists do before an attack!)
13. FBI needs to explain nor apologize to anyone in the lawful discharge of their duties to protect us.
American Citizens, (all of us--victims of 9-11, remember?) need not explain nor apologize to anyone for our own safety and self-preservation. World opinion be dammned.
Actions speak volumes. Communities who are truly "interested in ending terror" need to police themselves & help turn in their own bad apples. Until then, it's all p.c. rhetoric & b-crap.
Ask yourselves if this could ever have been imagined in WW2?! "Feelings?" Ha! We'd be a colony of every post-1945 agressor if we didn't watch and report things back then.
Buck up if you are an 'offended group' & ask the remaining Japanese-Americans & Germans & Italians in America during WW2 for pointers on being "singled-out" during war time. Unfair, but necessary. Too bad. Don't like it? There is the door.
14. Interesting, outraged pimp Muslims has the same reaction as Cato from yesterday's long comment thread. Both automatically assumed that the men were muslim and that publishing a photo to help find the men for FBI questioning represents defamation.
I bet there would have been no reaction from Cato or the AACC had those in the photo been European looking.
15. Jimmie blusters:
ask the remaining Japanese-Americans & Germans & Italians in America during WW2 for pointers on being "singled-out" during war time. Unfair, but necessary.
Say again? I think most Americans all over the spectrum have decided that the Japanese-American internship was an unnecessary disgrace to our country's values. And I don't think many Americans of German and Italian descent were confined during WWII; that's the point.
(Still, I agree with you on these ferry photos.)
17. Cair is funded by terrorist financial groups. Cair leaders routinely travel to get their "talking points". Democrats and liberals fall into this trap so easily.
Robert Spencer of jihadwatch is on a jihad to expose Cair and other phony advocacy groups. Michelle Malkin routinely refers to him. Robert is so dry he could take the humidity out of the rainforest, so he has to rely on facts to make his point. Very, very good read.
18. Ms Zawaideh was on the Bryan Suits show yesteday. He quickly had here talking out of both sides of her mouth and seeming pretty hipocritical. Any time she got caught up in agreeing with him, she would change the subject and try to start talking about how we aren't spending enough money on enforcement technology.
If you ask me, the guys look greek - so I am not sure what she is so concerned about. The press release mentioned nothing of race or religion.
19. So Arab and Muslim groups are upset about the photos? Gee, that's too bad, and I could care less. It wasn't a bunch of Catholic choir boys who flew those planes into the buildings on September 11, 2001.
20. Getting ready to cry them a river...or maybe not. Actually I resent that the RICO statutes have not been used to drive them from the country.
21. Underhanded, back door way for muslims to slowly subjugate the infidels to dhimmi status. Happening every day in Europe - and they're winning there. PC demands that we first ask permission from our overlords.
22. If Muslims don't like American justice, many of us would be glad to contribute to send them back where they came from, where they'd have their hands (or heads) cut off for questioning the government.
As far as I'm concerned, we should deal with disgruntled arabs in the same fashion as illegal aliens: WHEN IN DOUBT....KICK 'EM OUT!
23. Ok if they were Muslim, why doesn't the Muslim spokeswoman bring them forth and explain what they were doing? I am sure there is a reason: Perhaps they were learning how to drive (not dock) a ferry? That simple explaination would assist the ACLU's lawsuit of taking more of our tax money.
PS I thought they were Greek! Goes to show how stupid I am.
24. I'm white (blond hair blue eyes), and I'm muslim. My wife, who is ethnically Uzbek, is muslim. My two kids, who are a lot lighter than my wife but definitely not arab looking, are muslim.
Most muslims are Central Asian (not Arab)(or just plain asian asian).
I'm offended by CAIR insiniuating that I have to be an arab to be muslim, which is a RELIGION and not an ETHNICITY. Who do I sue?
BTW, pre-op planning is pre-op planning, whether it's tim mcveigh or 19 men learning to fly but not land planes.
25. News reports this morning said the FBI have received over 200 tips about these men. Those tips don't exist without those photographs. CAIR can hem and haw all they want. They won't get much sympathy, nor should they. The race of these men is irrelevant - it's their behavior, stupid.
26. Bruce,
You're sadly mistaken... Many Germans were interned during WWII, some of them were my relatives.
We never hear about the thousands of German internments because - GASP! - the German community, by and large, understood that it was a time of war and sometimes that means the rules are changed...
Or I could be a Progressive and say it's because of the RACIST society we live in where if you're not white ANYTHING that could be possible construed as insulting is tantamount to a complete revocation of the Bill of Rights, but if you happen to be fair skinned of European descent you have zero rights...
27. What short memories we have. Doesn't anyone here remember the civil rights struggles that brought Muslims their rights in America? Just as Rosa parks finally refused to move to the back of the bus, and began the long road to equal treatment for African-Americans, so did the 9/11 hijackers and their murder of thousands of American civilans punctuate the tradition of courage that so typifies our Muslim brothers and sisters.
Also -- I don't know about anyone else on this board, but personally, I can't think of a newspaper in America that does a better job of not reporting on security risks to our country, and of siding with ethnic and religious groups who wish to exert control over others' personal safety and freedom of speech, than the P-I.
We can only hope that the staff of the P-I are regular patrons of the Puget Sound ferry system, and wish them well on their daily commutes, insh'allah.
28.
Note to world:
Please contact me or my relatives anytime someone cited as being part of "organized crime" is mentioned.
We might "resent" it.
Capisci?
29. Bruce-
...And I don't think many Americans of German and Italian descent were confined during WWII...
Edmonds Dan beat me to it, but you are incorrect. Approximately 11,000 German Americans and around 250 Italian Americans were interned in camps. Nothing like 110,000 Japanese, but still a rather large number.
30. Wish America would see a lot more of messages like
Aaron #24 posted. Plus a lot less of the ones claiming they are Muslim and think America is always wrong.
31. I don't know how many "Japanese-Americans" were loyal to Hirohito, but some were, and that's the point. No one knew then and we don't know now. While some Americans weep for the interned Japanese-Americans, Japan is in denial about its actions during WWII. I submit to you that interned Japanese-Americans were treated far better than the 30,000,000 million+ Chinese and other peoples who were raped and murdered by Imperial Japan.
32. Quite telling actually.
Apparently what makes these Muslim "leaders" jumpy is what they know in their hearts or hearts what they refuse to admit publicly (but in fact state quite the opposite).
Not all Muslims are terrorists but all terrorists are Muslim.
33. Great to see the post at #2 embodying the values for which this country stands and fights.
"Cleansing" campaigns historically have been the way to go, haven't they.
34. Oh yeah, I wanted to mention to Independent Voter @ 3.
On the chance you weren't being tongue-in-cheek: Yes, the Seattle cops are told to "lay off" certain groups. The group is illegal immigrants. The Seattle City Council a few years ago handed down an "unofficial policy" (that's how it was explained to me) that the police, during contact or during a bust, weren't supposed to ask or check to see if somebody was here illegally. Now that Seattle is officially a "sanctuary city" this is still policy but weather it is codified into law or just a spoken rule is unknown to me. I believe that Bellevue is in the same boat with illegals as a group.
35. Looks like the Arab-American Community Coalition needs a new leader. While many of the liberal elite in Seattle would agree with Ms. Zawaideh, this women is totally off base. What next? Approval from NAMBLA before Amerian's Most Wanted can profile a male pedophile? Most of the media has made it quite clear that these men are just wanted for questioning and are NOT under investigation for any criminal act at this time. Ms. Zawaideh will be the first in line demanding why more wasn't done when the next tragedy strikes without ever realizing people like her are the reason more wasn't done. Yikes!
36. Interesting how the Muslim advocacy groups, including folks like Ms. Zawaideh, immediately jumped to the conclusion that these two suspicious-acting guys were Muslims and/or Arab. I guess they must know something we don't, huh? Especially considering that not one of the entities who published the pics mentioned the ethnicity or religion of the two.
37. I think the Seattle PI boys spent time in a local bathhouse with these two and are trying to protect their new love interests....
38. People fail to mention one interesting thing about Muslims and their faith. Slavery is alive and well in North Africa. Slave traders are mostly Moslem. Selling in Middle East and Eastern Europe. Some of these slave even make it to the US. Where is the Muslims in the US condemning this practice? You have a handful of moderates who do but Seattle well by their silence they must support Slavery.
Where is the condemnation of Moslems killing people of different faith in India, Pakistan, Iran, Indonesia and Sudan. I do not hear them talking out that it is wrong to do so. So they must support the actions of Muslims to kill those of not the same faith. The death toll in the past 15 years is in the Millions. No one knows how many people have been killed. But every year tens if not hundreds of thousands are killed. Silence by the Muslim community.
Because even in the US where we have freedom of religion. They do not have the courage to condemn evil done in the name of their religon. Their silence can be taken that they approve and support these actions.
I do not support attacking Muslims in the US. But I want to make a point. Why does the Muslim Community demand special rights and protections yet they themselves put themselves in the light as being terrorists because they will not condemn terrorism or acts of terrorism done in their name in dozens of countries around the world. Their silence makes them look as they support those same actions. Many Muslims do not but because of your silence how do we know. It is not racism. It is not attacking Muslims it is appearance. IF you want to gain my trust small things like condemning Muslim actions in Sudan of ethnic cleansing and being vocal about it. But the rules of never condemning the actions of another Muslim only makes me think that you support and give support for those actions. Your inaction to condemn evil in the world speaks louder than the words of your spokesman trying to prevent any inquire into the Moslem community.
Are you hiding terrorists in your midst? IS that why you are so vocal against any questioning of your community. Do you see the corner you are painting yourself into? How can I trust you if all I see is stopping any inquires? The bottom line is that you have to earn trust. Sometimes it takes only one to start the ball of correcting an evil activity. Look hard at your faith. Slavery is wrong. Can you not condemn that little activity that is taking place in North Africa? Can not your religious leaders speak out against it? The US has religious freedom. Or do the terrorist have that much control even in the US to prevent good people from condemning evil?
If that is the case then you community had better be investigated if you live in fear due to terrorists.
39. "Or do the terrorist have that much control even in the US to prevent good people from condemning evil?"
That, David, is the crux of the matter. It's the Mafia model.
40. The very day this story was in the P-I, the adjacent story was about the elected lady who got the DUI. Of course, she pleaded not guilty.
Attacks? 3k?
Alcohol-related driving deaths? 30k roughly.
Americans who die of the FLU each year? 30k.
It is a pleasure to read the writings of all the local genius folk who can see the damn big picture.
41. Yes, it is a refreshing change from HA, I agree.
42. YouGuysAreGeniuses--
I'm quite sure that more than 3k Americans have died from terrorist attacks over time. (Anybody have the exact number?) Not to mention that many more non-US civilian deaths have been a result of THOUSANDS of terrorist attacks.
The similarity between terrorist attacks and dying from the flu or alcohol-related driving deaths is that they are all mostly preventable.
The difference, YouGuys, is the intent. I really don't think the flu virus has a vendetta against the United States and democracy, and drunk drivers don't choose their victims. Terrorist attacks are deliberate. Also, the mode of prevention is different in each case. You can do your best to defend yourself against a nasty flu virus, but sometimes it doesn't always work. You can try and keep keys away from their drunk owners, or limit alcohol consumption...but like I said, it doesn't always work. And yes, trying to prevent terrorist attacks doesn't always work...but does that mean we should stop? Sometimes we can prevent a flu epidemic, and sometimes we can actually keep the keys from the drunk and prevent another immediate loss of life.
Do you really want us to subject ourselves to another attack if we can nip it in the bud now? A life is a life, no matter the method of death. Let's try to prevent as many deaths as possible and watch out for suspicious characters.
I dunno, I can see the big picture...the question is, can you?
43. Lets get an idea of the number of attacks in the world by year.
Year Attacks Dead Injured # of Countries
2002 694 6288 9624 23
2003 831 3366 6828 33
2004 1021 7127 12956 37
2005 1554 7653 12861 35
2006 2284 15242 19535 44
2007 1805 15231 20053 32
Real numbers but I estimate maybe a million more may have been killed in North Africa. It is impossible to tell the number killed. Entire villages destroyed.
In the news today 44 killed in India. Exposives used at two amusement parks. http://www.zeenews.com/articles.asp?aid=391023&sid=REG&ssid=&news=Atleast%2044%20killed%20in%20Hyderabad%20serial%20blasts
Targets women and children. People taking some time off. India has been way below normal for terrorist attacks this year. Normally they have about 300 a year. Well about 110 attacks so far this year.
Lets see Iran tortured a Lesbian's Father trying to find her. I think they wanted to kill her.
http://www.adnkronos.com/AKI/English/Politics/?id=1.0.1233971364
Now lets look at the people we were helping in Kosovo. Christian girl raped in Muslim dominated Kosovo http://www.serbianna.com/news/2007/02187.shtml
The last paragraph says something very interesting.
Kosovo is a Serbian province where extremist Muslim Albanians have expelled over two-thirds of the Christian population in an attempt to make the province religiously pure Islamic and now seek out of the UN to be an independent state.
Ethnic Cleansing done by Muslims not Christians. Why are our troops still there?
I see very few articles where Muslims protect Christian Neighbors from attack. But I see a lot of attacks by Muslims on non-Muslims.
As in the numbers listed above. The Religion of Peace sure kill a lot of people in many countries.
What does it take for the Muslim community to take the Blinders from their eyes to condemn actions of Muslim's using their faith to do evil. Or is the Muslim faith not a Religion of Peace. There silence is all we hear. And it makes me want to question if they are a Religion of Peace. I have Muslim friends that do condemn these types of actions yet the Muslim leadership will not. So I wonder who side they really are on.
44. Dan & Mike, I stand corrected about German-American internments; thanks for teaching me some history. But I don't think that, as Dan claims, most German-Americans were fine with it. The link doesn't suggest that, either. I suspect it's less well-known because a much smaller fraction of German-Americans were interned than Japanese-Americans. Both internments were wrong.
45. Bruce
I disagree that both internments were wrong. Enemy aliens in time of war--and quite probably their dependents--should be interned. 30% of the Japanese interned were aliens (I don't know how many of the others were dependents). Was this too much? I don't know, but given the fight we were in at the time erring on the side of caution was reasonable.
46. Bravo Katomar #36.
Ms. Zawaideh sees a public photo of two dudes the FBI wants to talk with. She goes all-out to protest, on behalf of the Arab-American Community Coalition, the lack of an apology to her constituency for the FBI doing its duty. She's chuffed that the FBI did so without subjecting itself to her self-appointed veto power.
But just a gol-darned minute. The photo said nothing about the race, religion or culture of the two dudes. As others have noted above, they could legitimately be thought to be Arabs, Turks, Kurds, Greeks, Spaniards, Persians, Italians, Welshmen, Armenians or dozens of other ethnicities who have members exhibiting roughly the same coloring and facial structure.
Methinks Ms. Zawaideh doth protest too much. Those blokes might not be Arabs or Muslims at all. But now we can wonder if she knows them personally, or has heard panicked complaints from their friends or relatives - and therefore she's given away the store. Her protest is practically an admission confirming that two Arab-Muslim blokes did pretty strange, organized and premeditated deeds in reconnaisance of Washington State Ferries.
We might conclude hopefully that the two probably are a couple of continents away from Puget Sound today, after the publication of that photo. But we should also wonder who their friends are, and who's inherited their mission. And if we shouldn't, at least the FBI should.
47. Terrorists? Never mind terrorists. WAITRESSES are the real enemy.
48. Anyone else see
this?! ... sure, move along, nothing to see here ...
49. Islam is not now nor ever was/is a religion of peace. It was spread by the sword...convert or die. It is about total power, not about religion. When you have the founder who was a murderer and child molester what else can ever be expected from this so called religion. It is a cult of death, nothing more..nothing less. The so called culture of the middle east is what?....no arts, no science..nothing but death. What this area is given credit to cannot be substantiated at all......it would appear they "took" from other cultures to claim it as their own. If we want to maintain our westerern civilization, we just might need to repatriate these folks back to their native lands. This could last until the war on islamic terrorists is won. We don't need these people in this country. I am tired of being frisked every time I fly. PROFILE......PROFILE......PROFILE. While it may be true that not all muslims are terrotists, it is true that all terrorists are indeed muslim. Lets cut the crap of PC.....lets get real in protecting ouselves....If these people don't like it...tough....turn in all terrorist sympathizers and quit giving to so called charities that we all know support terrorists activities. This may anger some muslims, but guess what...I don't care. Heck, they are always angry about something. Let them eat sand.
50. Islam is not now nor ever was/is a religion of peace. It was spread by the sword...convert or die. It is about total power, not about religion. When you have the founder who was a murderer and child molester what else can ever be expected from this so called religion. It is a cult of death, nothing more..nothing less. The so called culture of the middle east is what?....no arts, no science..nothing but death. What this area is given credit to cannot be substantiated at all......it would appear they "took" from other cultures to claim it as their own. If we want to maintain our westerern civilization, we just might need to repatriate these folks back to their native lands. This could last until the war on islamic terrorists is won. We don't need these people in this country. I am tired of being frisked every time I fly. PROFILE......PROFILE......PROFILE. While it may be true that not all muslims are terrotists, it is true that all terrorists are indeed muslim. Lets cut the crap of PC.....lets get real in protecting ouselves....If these people don't like it...tough....turn in all terrorist sympathizers and quit giving to so called charities that we all know support terrorists activities. This may anger some muslims, but guess what...I don't care. Heck, they are always angry about something. Let them eat sand.
51. Islam is not now nor ever was/is a religion of peace. It was spread by the sword...convert or die. It is about total power, not about religion. When you have the founder who was a murderer and child molester what else can ever be expected from this so called religion. It is a cult of death, nothing more..nothing less. The so called culture of the middle east is what?....no arts, no science..nothing but death. What this area is given credit to cannot be substantiated at all......it would appear they "took" from other cultures to claim it as their own. If we want to maintain our westerern civilization, we just might need to repatriate these folks back to their native lands. This could last until the war on islamic terrorists is won. We don't need these people in this country. I am tired of being frisked every time I fly. PROFILE......PROFILE......PROFILE. While it may be true that not all muslims are terrotists, it is true that all terrorists are indeed muslim. Lets cut the crap of PC.....lets get real in protecting ouselves....If these people don't like it...tough....turn in all terrorist sympathizers and quit giving to so called charities that we all know support terrorists activities. This may anger some muslims, but guess what...I don't care. Heck, they are always angry about something. Let them eat sand.
52. Sorry about the multiple postings...computer problems. Ya'll have a great American day.
53. Nice post on the outrageous behavior of Muslim-Arab special interest groups, Stefan. Living in the NW, I too wondered why anyone in law enforcement needs to get permission from such a group to do their jobs.
On my ROIcopy blog, I tackled the related topic of the Opus cartoon being censored. If you're interested, you can read it at http://roicopy.com/2007/08/30/washington-post-other-newspapers-afraid-to-run-cartoon-mocking-radical-islam/ .